Old question, new slant. Help needed please.

It's been a long time away but I have kept viewing these forums. Auto focus with Pentax when photographing birds in flight. The general consensus has been that Pentax are too slow to catch said shots. After spending the summer searching the likes of flickr, I'm not at all sure that this is wholly correct.

I would like someone with the knowledge to tell me if my current thoughts are correct or otherwise.

1. It is the Pentax camera that is slow and therefore can't be improved upon. OR

2. It is only the lens that has a slow auto focus and can be improved upon. eg. The Pentax 50-200 kit lens, I think, is generally regarded as not the best to have. So, this may not be fast enough to capture birds in flight.

3. For want of an example, by using a Tamron 18-270 or similar, Sigma etc lens, will have a fast enough auto focus so therefore will be able to capture birds in flight.

I am still using a Canon 700D but still want to return to a Pentax. One reason but not the only one is that Pentax have two control buttons/wheels for shutter speed and aperture stops. This would be a huge help to me as I have great difficulty using the Canon system which does nothing to assist my arthritic fingers. Many thanks to those of you who may be able to help me.

Hi

1. I think you are correct it is the camera, although it has improved with the K3.

2. To some degree the lens can effect focus speed eg SDM v Screw drive. Larger aperture etc.

3. relates to 2.

The thing you have not mentioned is Focus Tracking which I think is where other brand score highly compared to Pentax when you are trying for birds in flight.

Birds in flight covers so much.

We've seen good pictures of gannet, owls, and puffins on here for example.

Kingfishers, finches, and little brown jobs are a lot harder. What are you wanting to photograph?

Last weekend Buzzard & Kestrel in our park hand held. My old Pentax K5, DA*300mm F4 used at F5.6, ISO 200 1/1000th second. My error I had pattern metering on when it should have been centre weighted. Centre spot AF. Dull day so got away with metering error.

I guess 18 out of 20 OK. My old 55 300 would have hunted around so yes the lens matters. Cropped heavily as quite high overhead.

link

i have had no problems with birds in flight its just you have to antisipate what they are going to do look on my profile and see what you think i was useing a sigma 70 to 300 lens and a k10which as died since i tripped over the camera bag

Thanks chaps, I've looked at both your shots and I think that they are not much different from mine taken with a Canon 650D and 700D.

wvbarnes, I see that you have used a prime 300mm lens on your K5.

stu62, I can only see the one bird shot but I'm impressed.

Blythman, Whatever birds are around when I am out and about. I have some half decent ones of a seagull, swans etc.

I'm thinking that even with a K50, providing I set the shutter speed to above 1000th or so and use continual shooting, I should get some decent shots. Right or wrong.

It has been the posts about Pentax cameras not being too good at fast moving subjects that has stopped me from reverting to Pentax last winter. Even one or two 'official type' reviews have mentioned it.

I find the 300 prime a big improvement. i use continuous AF for it. Not good on 55 - 300 due to hunting and screw drive noise

I only use centre point AF for telephoto and centre weighted metering when I remember.

I find turning off shake reduction helps if you know you are to be panning.

I find 1/1000th or faster best if enough light. Next week out in the Eastern Med I'll get away with very high shutter speeds, so much light even in October.

I program one of the custom settings ready for action use, (five on K5's three on the dial on K3) for action shots including back button autofoucs (covered on this forum.

I've seen nothing to indicate equipment is inferior. One day I'll hopefully be as good as Blythman (Alan)

would you say that using back button autofocus produces better results compared to using the shutter button?
I noticed a difference when I had the K3, and possibly when I used the K50 as well.

I'm still getting used to it after reading about it on here. When in use it means you have single AF on one press, continuous AF when your thumb holds it down and of course manual focus on the shutter button as AF there is disabled. You can then of course use the manual quick focus ring as well. Everything at once in other words.

which one did you see the vulture or thelcon Gedski
stu62

[quote:3496ace15f="stu62"]which one did you see the vulture or thelcon Gedski
stu62[/quote

Bottom right of nine shots. I think it is the vulture stu62.

I'm going to spend the weekend searching for 'moving targets' taken using the Pentax K50 and the K5 as it will probably be one of these that I will revert to. It depends on how much I am offered in part exchange. I need to get the best deal available to me. Thanks for all the help and feel free to pile more upon me.

I find my set up with a K3 and 300DA* great for everything except this. I have tried lots of recommended settings that I've read for continuous focus for BIF and frankly I've found it hopeless. My friend standing next to me with a Canon 700D does better every time with a SIgma 150-500 on it. The problem is that it usually can't find anything in the sky for so long it's gone. If it does find it it is slightly better than Pentax DSLR's up to K30 but not significantly. Only proviso is friend is 40 not 65 and I find that combination pretty heavy but my failure rate is so high, that if BIF were a priority of mine I would change to one of the ones that are known to be good at it. Aeroplanes - different kettle of fish - easy, works well.
I'm not giving up and there is a slight possibility that my DA* 300 doesn't have as snappy focusing as it should, although the Kingfisher pic in my gallery shows it is capable at times.
Dave

As I've mentioned, Pentax can cope with bigger birds, although in my experience more keepers would be had with a 7D

As to smaller birds I haven't had much success with flight shots.

Here are some various big birds. With the exception of puffins, fulmar and razorbill, these are fairly slow moving.

Puffins with the K3 and DA300
https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/puffins-in-flight-50157

Barn owl K3, DA 300 and 1.4xTC
https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/last-night-s-barn-owl-50134

Spoonbills K3 and DA560
https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/spoonbills-49884

Barn Owls K5, DA 300 and 1.4xTC
https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/barn-owls-iso-4000-49860

Barn Owls K3 and DA560
https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/barn-owl-49827

Various at Bempton K5 and I think the DA300
https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/a-selection-from-bempton-cliffs-41670

Shorties, K5 ans Sigma 150-500
https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/iso-8-000-39685
https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/short-eared-owls--saturday-3rd-march-nort...

look on dpreview after looking at the k50 i would go for the k5 or the varients of it as you can do a lot more with the k5 than the k50 and there should be a photo of a falcon on there and a top fuel dragster which i have taken in full flight so to speak
stu

I doubt you will find much difference in autofocus speed between Pentax cameras from the last few years as tbh it hasn't improved that much (only in very small increments). The latest K-3 is supposedly the best so far (not in my experience, I found it too hit and miss on fast moving subjects for my liking) but having gone through all the top Pentax cameras since the K10D I would say the K-5II/s is probably your best bet ... but then I know nothing about the K-50. Also Pentax's idea of AF tracking (which you need for BIF shots) is so far behind the other major players it's unbelievable.

Pentax's achilles heel right now though is SDM, it's far too slow when compared to Canon's USM and Sigmas HSM lens motors, the old screw drive is actually faster (my Sigma 100-300mm F4 is the fastest focusing lens in Pentax mount and that's screw drive) but hopefully they will start to use the DC system more, which I find much faster.

Saying all that it can be done and when it is the results can be superb but I have to say that personally, if I go out to take pictures of anything moving fast then 9/10 times I will take my Canon gear as the keeper rate is much improved. (but for everything else I take Pentax).