since the criticism is well founded,i dont think i can blame your criticism,i was educated in black country ,west mids,where some of the poorest performing schools in england are,i managed to get gcse grade 1,s in maths ,physics ,biology,and chemistry,so not entirly thick.i am proud of being black country even if many of us are bad at english,as my parents were brought up honest, and passed on same values.i could never be branded a snob,but i,ve been called a racist,because i admitted i had moved to sandwich,kent, 8 years ago to get my children a education in a mainly white grammar school,as opposed(or apposed,i think either word can be used in this context,but its this kind of example that made me hate english at about the age of seven and being stuborn ,i was never the english teachers pet,lol) to sending them to the 70% black secondry school i went to.i dont think its a crime to make choices for your kids future ,and being honest about why a schools performance has fallen to new lows.
Skip to the present ,kids are doing well,non whites in thier school are doing equally well and if you met them blindfold would not know thier colour,they have no attitude that is noticable.which only goes to show its not a colour problem as much as a community issue.But moving to sandwich has not turned any of my family into snob,s thank god.
And on that note snobbery is judging people,and its gods job to judge, as i was taught at school.i see snobbery as two of the deadly sins combined.pride and vanity.

and on subject of cars,first car morris minor at 16,sat on front garden getting customised for a year,was looking cool,second car aged 17 capri 1.6gt in gold,tried to drive it two miles home and got picked up half way by old bill .no cars for next six years.lol.first road legal car ital estate(yes marina lol)was actualy very reliable and a great passion waggon,say no more.two skoda estelles(both of which never let me down and sold for more than purchase price),next carlton cdi,then omega estate(caravan days).then mercs.but also toy time for me,dutton phaeton,next beauford 2 door tourer ,both kit cars.toyota mr2 trike,model t vintage van replica,and the best of the bunch tvr cerbera(only got 170 from her,roads round by where we lived where too short ,but three times speed limit was fun)...none of my toys lost much money(beauford brought for £5k,and 8 years later sold for£9k) ,the tvr being the biggest loss, bought for £10k and sold for £8k to my best friend.but the profile is building,very different,like bmw m3,s , range rovers,and many others but never went down that avenue,had to be different.got a new baby at 44,so no more fast or dangerous cars,

wow what a can of worms just posted on another topic(18-55 replacement)and a lot of what i said there had relevence here,people with too much money buying what they dont even truly need,we are all guilty at some point i guess.i read a book recently by scott kelby saying 5mp is plenty,he also said invest in good glass but never once mentions old glass,or even promotes pentax,i will forgive him that,obviously he wants to be popular so why not pick two most succesfull brands,dont think he,s getting any dosh off canon or nikon,or he would have said pixels count.so why do we buy pentax,for some of us price,others like me weigh up everything and look for reasons not to follow the masses(canonites),to stand out as different but not foolish or insane,pentax is where we have ended up..and samsung rocks (might be around longer than pentax)....samsung gx20,pentax k10d,pentax k200d,olympus E20p.tons of old glass and old cameras,but born and bred black country.so couldnt pass for a snob...lol.

i would spend your money on old glass every time,(1)its a investment ,(2)your not likely to break it,(3)to use it you have to improve your skills,alway a plus,(4)though its climbed a lot in price in recent years it still represents great value for money..I now have a hell of a lot of old glass,but its of no consequence to me,as i know it wont loose value.do you think i could say that of £2000 worth of new glass,its like a car 20% lost the moment it leaves the shop,and then gradually loosing value from there,with the soft plastic picking up scratches andlooking grubby a lot faster than a old super takumar ever did, ie-if you could go back in time and check the average tak at three years of age i bet 95%+ looked mint.one cheap 50mm 1.7f i rate is the chinon,but i prefere 55mm version more.and i think at 58mm helios 44m lenses are tak sharp.agree sigma 24mm is a gem that can still be found cheap,and cheaper still if you spot a cheap camera with three good primes with it.got zenit olympic 1980em with 28mm helios,58mm helios,135mm helios set for £42 in great condition other day.bargains are out there to be had.sorry for waffling but see some of you debating expensive glass and wonder if your wives know that you can achieve the same shots with glass a fraction of the price,or even have any idea how much your hobbies actually cost..as a example of loosing money,spotted a olympus e20p(5mp)for sale with all extra lenses including 300mm,all boxed £150,jumped on it of course.but in each box was reciept from 2001/2002 totalling over £2000..and looking at the camera it doesnt look like its took 2000 shots.i rest my case ,old glass rules ..

well its 800mm really,and the tripod is only a middlewieght,so i was pleased,but will keep playing,trying out any suggestions and hopefully improve shot,one thing i tried was tightening screws and nuts and bolts on tripod ,sure it helped.

well i said i,m a complete novice who will be in this very nice appartment most of the next few years looking after our baby,the air con works great,its 32 degrees on balcony right now,and at 9.30pm i see the most beautifull view of the sun's reflections on the towers glass as it sinks lower in the sky.i am not one for watching movies in english over and over,and the spanish tv is painfull with my 50-60 words of spanish.so i,ve turned to photography,and after a few years i hope someone will actually tell me i,m good with a camera,but with my grey matter fading fast i wont hold my breath.

this shot is with cheap 400mm and cheap converter,can even pick out the cables on the window cleaners cranes.

to get a idea of distance ,towers in distance are 52 storeys

i hate people who truly belive the hype,my kids in the past have said to me in the supermarket "if you buy that i,m not eating it" because it was not ,hienz,or some other well known brand.often i would chalenge them to a blindfold test to see if they could tell the brand they claimed was superior,in most instances they could not ,if they got it right,you shuffle the plates and they would then sometimes fluff it second time .my best shot of the towers has been took with a very cheap 400mm lens,my more expensive tair 3 could not beat it, admitedly only 300mm,but twice the wieght.

i think i have moved the topic a little here,testing as oppossed to whats cheaper than £50,well thats a hard one for me as i brought camera,s with on average three lenses with them,my rule of thumb being analize lenses included,work out which one was on sale for the most money buy it now from dealers and bid that amount,of course the dealer lens may be in much better condition and overpriced in first place,but as i saw it the camera body and two other lenses were my bonus if i won.some were in only fair condition,but others mint,but what do i do with 50+ slr bodies i dont need ,pentax have a poor following in spain.so may have to come back to uk and list a load while i,m there.filled a 500 litre roof box plus the back of the car.fleabay is so addictive once you start buying.once i have got a good set up and test piece for my testing i will test everything up to maybe 200mm.my lenses beyond that i have already had a showdown with,with a shocking winner again,but i will conduct the test again searching harder for each lenses sweet spot.my test piece for this test was the beautifull towers in madrid,which are about three miles away.i will post my best shot so far ,and hopefully a better one soon.learning a little each day and enjoying it ,thanks to everyone who contributes to the forum,if we all contribute a little more we help to keep pentax alive.i remember the comodore amiga computers,they were superior(imo)to the bill gates equivalent at the time,but marketing played its part and it died a death,though i think the apples origins have a little to do with the amiga,so all was not lost.my point is,some people buy by name others read a lot then decide,i went for repayment mortgage 18 years ago because there was not one carrot dangled before me to steer me in that direction,my friend's opted for all sorts of offers and banged on about big money at end of endowment,a few even quoted that their financial advisers had told them it was the way to go,i told them all unless we had twenty five years of thriving britain ahead they would be making a mistake ,and five years on they were moaning that the banks had asked them to up thier repayments ,SO IMHO PENTAX IS A TOP BRAND THAT YOU CAN GET STARTED WITH RELATIVLY CHEAPLY(IF SOME OF THE BEST PHOTO,S HAPPEN TO HAVE BEEN TAKEN WITH OTHER NAME BRANDS ,ALL I SEE IS SOME OF THE WORLDS BEST PHOTOGRAPHERS ARE BEING LED BY MARKET FORCES,WE ALL KNOW THESE SAME PHOTOGRAPHERS CAN TAKE ACE SHOTS WHATEVER THE BRAND OF CAMERA THEY PICK UP ).