In the Museum
Posted 04/03/2010 - 11:09
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I was actually rather disappointed in these shots generally.
The first would have been better to have been at a smaller aperture and get both the people and the painting in focus. I was, however, already at 1600 ISO and the reason it is in BW is because the noise is dire.
The second, I did deliberately focus on the statue's face, it seemed the important thing to be in focus. On this occasion I could have upped the ISO and had a slightly smaller aperture. I could have also taken a few more but as always, it looked OK on LCD and less good on the PC.
The third is heavily cropped as I was all the way across a large hall. In this case I think the softness is camera shake combined with the crop.
Compositionally, I like the first one best but it is ruined by the softness of the people. The young son and father seemingly oggling the lady in the painting was what I was after. And it is a grabbed shot in the sense that people rarely stay more than, what, 15 seconds? in front of an exhibit. At least no one was shooting at me!
I get very self conscious photographing strangers in a museum, and the K20D with the DA* 50-135mm is hardly inconspicuous, perhaps I should have used the 43mm Ltd. I think next time I'll load up the MX with Tri-x, fit the 40mm pancake and put it in it's muffler case.
By the way, I don't mind criticism. I knew, really, that these weren't good enough but I was hoping I'd get away with it. I think we have all done that now and again!
K.
The first would have been better to have been at a smaller aperture and get both the people and the painting in focus. I was, however, already at 1600 ISO and the reason it is in BW is because the noise is dire.
The second, I did deliberately focus on the statue's face, it seemed the important thing to be in focus. On this occasion I could have upped the ISO and had a slightly smaller aperture. I could have also taken a few more but as always, it looked OK on LCD and less good on the PC.
The third is heavily cropped as I was all the way across a large hall. In this case I think the softness is camera shake combined with the crop.
Compositionally, I like the first one best but it is ruined by the softness of the people. The young son and father seemingly oggling the lady in the painting was what I was after. And it is a grabbed shot in the sense that people rarely stay more than, what, 15 seconds? in front of an exhibit. At least no one was shooting at me!
I get very self conscious photographing strangers in a museum, and the K20D with the DA* 50-135mm is hardly inconspicuous, perhaps I should have used the 43mm Ltd. I think next time I'll load up the MX with Tri-x, fit the 40mm pancake and put it in it's muffler case.
By the way, I don't mind criticism. I knew, really, that these weren't good enough but I was hoping I'd get away with it. I think we have all done that now and again!
K.
Kris Lockyear
It is an illusion that photos are made with the camera… they are made with the eye, heart and head. Henri Cartier-Bresson
Lots of film bodies, a couple of digital ones, too many lenses (mainly older glass) and a Horseman LE 5x4.
It is an illusion that photos are made with the camera… they are made with the eye, heart and head. Henri Cartier-Bresson
Lots of film bodies, a couple of digital ones, too many lenses (mainly older glass) and a Horseman LE 5x4.
Posted 04/03/2010 - 11:44
Link
Kris - I hadn't realised how far you'd pushed these already which makes the softness understandable but I have moved on a little now in terms of the discussion.
It's my contention that in general shots like these need to look sharp as there is no apparent movement nor reason for it, in fact quite the reverse as they convey the contemplative mood of the context well.
I will return with now three shots which I hope illustrate my point. But I really should be working!
Mike
It's my contention that in general shots like these need to look sharp as there is no apparent movement nor reason for it, in fact quite the reverse as they convey the contemplative mood of the context well.
I will return with now three shots which I hope illustrate my point. But I really should be working!
Mike
---------------------------------------------------
You can see some of my shots at my Flickr account.
You can see some of my shots at my Flickr account.
Posted 04/03/2010 - 17:05
Link
Having said I'll do this I better had
1
OK this was taken using a 21mm lens so the one lady was almost on top of me but hey it's sharp. It would be rubbish if it wasn't, it may well pretty poor anyway but at least the technicals are pretty good. I had poor but way better light than Kris.
2
Once again not good light and I was standing in the same place for some time and really did need to grab shots while the subject and local riff raff (and that's being kind) didn't see me.
3
This one was never meant to be sharp although the original is actually sharp enough to see grains of sand. Not a grab shot but one where I decided to manipulate the situation on a really dull day.
4
Finally a really poor shot!
This is comparable conditions to Kris - and the camera was in the bag when I saw the shot I wanted. It was a race against time get the shot I wanted and I failed. I think the exposure was about a quarter of a second hand held. On the other hand look at the straps of the handbag.
I think I have rather lost the plot of the point I wanted to make but basically what I'm saying some shots have to be sharp and some don't. Kris's needed to be (saving his grace) especially number 3.
Naturally you should all feel free to rip into me - nothing like some frank debate.
Mike
1
OK this was taken using a 21mm lens so the one lady was almost on top of me but hey it's sharp. It would be rubbish if it wasn't, it may well pretty poor anyway but at least the technicals are pretty good. I had poor but way better light than Kris.
2
Once again not good light and I was standing in the same place for some time and really did need to grab shots while the subject and local riff raff (and that's being kind) didn't see me.
3
This one was never meant to be sharp although the original is actually sharp enough to see grains of sand. Not a grab shot but one where I decided to manipulate the situation on a really dull day.
4
Finally a really poor shot!
This is comparable conditions to Kris - and the camera was in the bag when I saw the shot I wanted. It was a race against time get the shot I wanted and I failed. I think the exposure was about a quarter of a second hand held. On the other hand look at the straps of the handbag.
I think I have rather lost the plot of the point I wanted to make but basically what I'm saying some shots have to be sharp and some don't. Kris's needed to be (saving his grace) especially number 3.
Naturally you should all feel free to rip into me - nothing like some frank debate.
Mike
---------------------------------------------------
You can see some of my shots at my Flickr account.
You can see some of my shots at my Flickr account.
Posted 04/03/2010 - 17:40
Link
Hope you didn't get "done" for playing with photos when you were supposed to be working, Mike! But it was worth it. One and three are wonderful photos, very nicely framed under difficult circumstances. You're right about number one relying on 100% sharpness: it's perfect! I take it the 21mm lens is autofocus; must be great to use.
Neither two nor four work for me. Four becuase it's all over the place with subject movement, framing and focus, the second because the centre's dead and the old chap's walking out of the frame (which may, of course, have been the point!)
I find a hit rate of one in ten if I'm ever brave enough to have a go at street photography. My best session ever was last summer when I took some kids out on a photography course. Nobody minds them taking pictures and I sort of grabbed a few of my own whilst pretending to "instruct" them. (Talk about blind leading the blind!)
I'm not sure how one would rate them for sharpness but there were dozens of rejects...
[IMG]http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad116/ADC3440/Portfolio/pictures159.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad116/ADC3440/Portfolio/pictures154.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad116/ADC3440/Portfolio/pictures105.jpg[/IMG]
I used the 18-55 kit lens (that's all i had at the time) and all images have been enlarged and printed to A2 for illustrative purposes.
Best wishes,
Andrew
Neither two nor four work for me. Four becuase it's all over the place with subject movement, framing and focus, the second because the centre's dead and the old chap's walking out of the frame (which may, of course, have been the point!)
I find a hit rate of one in ten if I'm ever brave enough to have a go at street photography. My best session ever was last summer when I took some kids out on a photography course. Nobody minds them taking pictures and I sort of grabbed a few of my own whilst pretending to "instruct" them. (Talk about blind leading the blind!)
I'm not sure how one would rate them for sharpness but there were dozens of rejects...
[IMG]http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad116/ADC3440/Portfolio/pictures159.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad116/ADC3440/Portfolio/pictures154.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad116/ADC3440/Portfolio/pictures105.jpg[/IMG]
I used the 18-55 kit lens (that's all i had at the time) and all images have been enlarged and printed to A2 for illustrative purposes.
Best wishes,
Andrew
Best wishes,
Andrew
"These places mean something and it's the job of a photographer to figure-out what the hell it is."
Robert Adams
"The camera doesn't make a bit of difference. All of them can record what you are seeing. But, you have to SEE."
Ernst Hass
My website: http://www.ephotozine.com/user/bwlchmawr-199050
http://s927.photobucket.com/home/ADC3440/index
https://www.flickr.com/photos/78898196@N05
Andrew
"These places mean something and it's the job of a photographer to figure-out what the hell it is."
Robert Adams
"The camera doesn't make a bit of difference. All of them can record what you are seeing. But, you have to SEE."
Ernst Hass
My website: http://www.ephotozine.com/user/bwlchmawr-199050
http://s927.photobucket.com/home/ADC3440/index
https://www.flickr.com/photos/78898196@N05
Posted 04/03/2010 - 17:43
Link
I'm keeping up Mike (just barely ), and I'm pretty sure I agree. My personal opinion is that all photos should have sharp subjects unless the photographer deliberately chooses otherwise (e.g. soft portraits, motion blurred movement, etc). I think the only time you can get away with soft shots is once-in-a-lifetime never-to-be-repeated situations like Capa's beach landing shots.
There was an interesting (albeit somewhat tongue-in-cheek) article on Enticing the Light this week about what makes a great shot that briefly covers some similar ideas. Essentially he's saying that it's easier to make a 'Great' photo in an exotic location where no other photographers will compete with you (a la Capa on the beach). His actual example was the Mars rover photos:
There was an interesting (albeit somewhat tongue-in-cheek) article on Enticing the Light this week about what makes a great shot that briefly covers some similar ideas. Essentially he's saying that it's easier to make a 'Great' photo in an exotic location where no other photographers will compete with you (a la Capa on the beach). His actual example was the Mars rover photos:
Quote:
"I could call up the guys at the Mars Exploration Rover Mission and tell them how much they suck at stitching photographs (haven’t they heard of Hugin?) and how terrible the photo looks. They would probably say, you think you can do a better job? Then go ahead and get your arse over to Mars to take some pics with your fancy panorama head and tripod. That isn’t going to happen, is it? Like the great philosopher said: When there ain’t no competition, you’re best by definition™."
"I could call up the guys at the Mars Exploration Rover Mission and tell them how much they suck at stitching photographs (haven’t they heard of Hugin?) and how terrible the photo looks. They would probably say, you think you can do a better job? Then go ahead and get your arse over to Mars to take some pics with your fancy panorama head and tripod. That isn’t going to happen, is it? Like the great philosopher said: When there ain’t no competition, you’re best by definition™."
Tim
AF - Pentax K5, Sigma 10-20/4-5.6, Tamron 17-50/2.8, Sigma 30/1.4, Sigma 70-200/2.8, Tamron 70-300/4-5.6
MF - Vivitar CF 28/2.8, Tamron AD2 90/2.5, MTO 1000/11
Stuff - Metz 58 AF1, Cactus v4, Nikon SB24, Raynox 150, Sigma 1.4x TC, Sigma 2x TC, Kenko 2x macro TC, Redsnapper 283 tripod, iMac 27”, Macbook Pro 17”, iPad, iPhone 3G
Flickr • Fluidr • PPG • Street • Portfolio site
Feel free to edit any of my posted photos! If I post a photo for critique, I want brutal honesty. If you don't like it, please say so and tell me why!
AF - Pentax K5, Sigma 10-20/4-5.6, Tamron 17-50/2.8, Sigma 30/1.4, Sigma 70-200/2.8, Tamron 70-300/4-5.6
MF - Vivitar CF 28/2.8, Tamron AD2 90/2.5, MTO 1000/11
Stuff - Metz 58 AF1, Cactus v4, Nikon SB24, Raynox 150, Sigma 1.4x TC, Sigma 2x TC, Kenko 2x macro TC, Redsnapper 283 tripod, iMac 27”, Macbook Pro 17”, iPad, iPhone 3G
Flickr • Fluidr • PPG • Street • Portfolio site
Feel free to edit any of my posted photos! If I post a photo for critique, I want brutal honesty. If you don't like it, please say so and tell me why!
Posted 04/03/2010 - 18:23
Link
@ Andrew the 21 is AF but I preset it to where I thought I would shoot which is what I usually do for street shots.
Forgive me but the focus is off on the first two of your shots unless as is quite possible I am mistaken. The exposure in all is good but maybe you could zip them up a bit with some levels and contrast?
@Tim I think we are in agreement!
This one fails because it is simply not sharp enough. Heavy crop and shaky hands.
And I was really disappointed when I saw this one in detail.
One chance and I fluffed it on technicalities.
Mike
Forgive me but the focus is off on the first two of your shots unless as is quite possible I am mistaken. The exposure in all is good but maybe you could zip them up a bit with some levels and contrast?
@Tim I think we are in agreement!
This one fails because it is simply not sharp enough. Heavy crop and shaky hands.
And I was really disappointed when I saw this one in detail.
One chance and I fluffed it on technicalities.
Mike
---------------------------------------------------
You can see some of my shots at my Flickr account.
You can see some of my shots at my Flickr account.
Posted 04/03/2010 - 19:18
Link
But still Mike, the first one is such a good shot in other respects, it has to be a prized photograph. Just look at their expressions and the overall feel of the thing. Great work!
Andrew
Andrew
Best wishes,
Andrew
"These places mean something and it's the job of a photographer to figure-out what the hell it is."
Robert Adams
"The camera doesn't make a bit of difference. All of them can record what you are seeing. But, you have to SEE."
Ernst Hass
My website: http://www.ephotozine.com/user/bwlchmawr-199050
http://s927.photobucket.com/home/ADC3440/index
https://www.flickr.com/photos/78898196@N05
Andrew
"These places mean something and it's the job of a photographer to figure-out what the hell it is."
Robert Adams
"The camera doesn't make a bit of difference. All of them can record what you are seeing. But, you have to SEE."
Ernst Hass
My website: http://www.ephotozine.com/user/bwlchmawr-199050
http://s927.photobucket.com/home/ADC3440/index
https://www.flickr.com/photos/78898196@N05
Posted 04/03/2010 - 19:31
Link
Kind words Andrew but I should have just got closer. They knew I was taking their photograph and I should have just walked up and taken my time. Instead I snatched and spoiled the shot.
The second one was just a complete cock up as I think I used AF.
Mike
The second one was just a complete cock up as I think I used AF.
Mike
---------------------------------------------------
You can see some of my shots at my Flickr account.
You can see some of my shots at my Flickr account.
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4798 posts
17 years
Saffron Walden,
Essex
Probably rather presumptious of me, but I'm sure Kris being a man of science won't mind any constructive thoughtful criticism.
AF - Pentax K5, Sigma 10-20/4-5.6, Tamron 17-50/2.8, Sigma 30/1.4, Sigma 70-200/2.8, Tamron 70-300/4-5.6
MF - Vivitar CF 28/2.8, Tamron AD2 90/2.5, MTO 1000/11
Stuff - Metz 58 AF1, Cactus v4, Nikon SB24, Raynox 150, Sigma 1.4x TC, Sigma 2x TC, Kenko 2x macro TC, Redsnapper 283 tripod, iMac 27”, Macbook Pro 17”, iPad, iPhone 3G
Flickr • Fluidr • PPG • Street • Portfolio site
Feel free to edit any of my posted photos! If I post a photo for critique, I want brutal honesty. If you don't like it, please say so and tell me why!