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First 'go' with the K-50, Oh! Dear!

walt
Posted 20/10/2014 - 10:48 Link
As mentioned in the other thread I always try to have SR off for BIF's. Good to hear that things are progressing, practice, practice, practise.

I notice others have mentioned not using centre point AF, but 5 point. I've tried this and the af just wouldn't stay on subject enough for me and slows down on locking often picking the background first. Also sometimes when it looses af it just sits there refusing to AF, so you have to give it a help by refocusing somewhere else and when it happens just as the hobby falcon dashes right past you chasing a dragonfly you tend to not use it again! I also tried expanded AF area. This was better than 5-point af, but still slowed down the initial acquisition, I felt. If you want to try this you need to go into the AF settings sub-menu (from menu button), and tick then expanded AF area box. Then you need to press the info button and change the AF Active area to 'Select'. The AF will then prioritise the point selected (select the centre af point) and then if it looses the subject off the centre point it will use the surrounding points to track. Like I said though I think this slows down the speed of AF. However I would say use whatever works best for you. I know some who swear that the 11-point AF works for them when tracking BIF's but I prefer centre only.
Walt
My newer photos google photos
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johnriley
Posted 20/10/2014 - 10:55 Link
Birds in flight are tricky at the best of times, but AF isn't perhaps the best way to go. Considering the distances involved and the ability to pre-focus on an area, I've had far better success using manual focus.

In some instances, such as using the Q with a DA lens, there's only the manual focus choice, but it does work and just needs practice, practice, practice....after all, generations of photographers who had no AF managed perfectly well.
Best regards, John
Blythman
Posted 20/10/2014 - 11:28 Link
johnriley wrote:
Birds in flight are tricky at the best of times, but AF isn't perhaps the best way to go. Considering the distances involved and the ability to pre-focus on an area, I've had far better success using manual focus.

In some instances, such as using the Q with a DA lens, there's only the manual focus choice, but it does work and just needs practice, practice, practice....after all, generations of photographers who had no AF managed perfectly well.

If AF isn't to be used in challenging situations like wildlife. then when is it to be used? The standard of wildlife photography is so much better than the previous era you hark back to, and a very good standard can be achieved by the masses.
Alan


PPG
Flickr
johnriley
Posted 20/10/2014 - 11:36 Link
I didn't say "isn't" though Alan, if it works for someone then that's fine. It's not perfect though, fast as it is.

When is it to be used? Almost always I would think, but I do find exceptions to that in some wildlife photography and some macro work.
Best regards, John
michaelblue
Posted 20/10/2014 - 11:45 Link
I worked with a professional wildlife photographer for a day and his best advice for photographing flying birds was "If the bird is against a clear sky use as many focus points as you have, if the bird is against a background (trees, grass etc. then stick to centre point autofocus and try to stay on the bird" Obvious when you think about it but not until he told us Since that piece of advice my 'keeper' rate has increased
Regards,
Michael
Blythman
Posted 20/10/2014 - 12:06 Link
I do agree there are exceptions. Tweaking of focus is often required because of the clutter of branches, when birds are in the bush.

Manual focus is also handy when there is a defined path from say a branch to a feeder at relatively close distances. But try that and see what the keeper rate is

Generally speaking for BIF, AF is the tool to use. Single spot AF for a cluttered background, and a larger grouping of Af points against a sky.

If you lose focus release the Af button immediately and start again

As to exposure, it doesn't matter if sonmeone prefers Centre-Weighted or Matrix or Spot. What is important is that they know what impact any current lighting situation will have on it. Birds against the sky usually require +EV dialled in. Another alternative is manual exposure. I often use this. Photographing the top of a telegraph pole in similar light, and adjusting the exposure until I have it correct.

EDIT:Michael beat me to the point on AF
Alan


PPG
Flickr
Edited by Blythman: 20/10/2014 - 12:08
Daronl
Posted 20/10/2014 - 19:48 - Helpful Comment Link
with regards to your post please see extract from my recent post regarding shooting birds in flight with a K3;

Link Posted 19/09/2014 - 23:39
hi All,

I' m on my 2nd K3,; not comfortable , the cameras will have a significant amount of serious work.

I am committed to a Pentax and have invested heavily to convert from Canon ( and will never go back).

K 3 - in the field; my first one did not perform like some of "it's siblings" , consistently slow focus and poor metering.

I had it replaced,; new one great on static subjects but on fast moving subjects not capable, tested with DA * 300' , DA * 200', DA* 60 - 250.; Focussing, slow and effectively unusable on flying birds , even under controlled conditions. Same thing, slow focus, poor metering, could not emulate photographs I have taken many years ago with a Z1P,; same set up same conditions.

Wish I could add something a little more positive.

Regards

Daron L

Gedski wrote:
Boy do I need help, please. Forgive the preamble but it does serve a point. Using a Canon 700D, for birds in flight shots, I just put the shutter speed to +/- 1000th and fired away and got a lot of good shots.

Right thought I, just do the same with the K-50 and Bob's me uncle. Wrong! As you can see from the blackbird shot in my gallery, that is not a very good shot but it is about the best that I managed. I went from 800th to 1600th and it got no better. Most of the bird shots were too dark and some weren't in focus. My 55-300mm new type lens hunted an awful lot.

The flower shot is far too dark and like my bird shots I couldn't find any way to get the picture at an acceptable brightness. The weather has and still is a very sunny, and bright day. So why am I struggling or should I have stuck with the 700D. Please don't say yes! Both shots are in my gallery and the wildlife one.

Jan.

Daronl
Gedski
Posted 21/10/2014 - 08:40 Link
Daronl,
Your post is of immense importance to myself. Yesterday my camera manifested two faults. As a result it has been returned and I am not going to get another Pentax. I have chosen something else.

Over the weekend I shot literally hundreds of shots of BIF and have no more than twenty that are presentable and even fewer that are fit to be seen. I still think the Pentax cameras are superior to the Canon but they really need to get the auto focus, tracking system sorted out, so it can at least be the equal of the other brands.

I am so sad to have deserted the ship but I want to take decent BIF shots often and not have to spend a lot of time trying to get things focused. Your information about the DA* series of lenses is also sad. For around £800-£1000 for a lens, I would certainly expect very good focusing. My thanks.
richandfleur
Posted 21/10/2014 - 09:05 Link
Gedski wrote:
Daronl,
Your post is of immense importance to myself. Yesterday my camera manifested two faults.

Out of interest, what were the faults please?

Mine has suffered from a weird mirror half lockup fault, twice now, very odd and cleared by shooting a few shots with no lenses attached.

The aperture motor has failed and was replaced under warranty. This was a full blown hardware fault which got progressively worse and worse.

And the camera randomly stops during the few times I've set up an interval shooting session for timelapse work. No error given, it just stops firing.

The last two above have turned out to be quite common unfortunately. I know other brands have issues, but for contrasts sake my K100d had no issues ever, other than a tendency to back focus a lot which I put down more to simply the stage of autofocus technology of the day. By contrast the K-30 focusses perfectly for me, given the right conditions, (ie not flying birds for a start!)
Edited by richandfleur: 21/10/2014 - 09:05
Blythman
Posted 21/10/2014 - 09:18 Link
I think we all know Pentax has limitations with AF. However, it is the easy option to just blame the tools. Your previous posts show that you still have a lot to learn.

Looking at the heron you posted in your gallery stating "My best still shot yet, I think." Unfortunatelyhe whites are blown, losing a lot of detail. It also doesn't look pin sharp on my screen. While you haven't taken control of either shutter speed or aperture. Shooting in "Action" mode. You need to be aware of both of these parameters, and the impact the have on ISO, as well as on the resulting image

Hope this doesn't sound to harsh, but you need to get the fundementals right on static birds before applying them to Birds in Flight, if you are looking to improve.
Alan


PPG
Flickr
Gedski
Posted 21/10/2014 - 12:41 Link
richandfleur, the faults are.

1. Unable to access 'M' mode.
2. 'Tav' mode takes up it's own space and that of
'M' mode.
3. Firmware confirmed as installed correctly but it has not.
All faults confirmed by seller and instructed to return.

Blythman, I agree with all that you say. However, I have not had any problems with other cameras when using shutter and or aperture priority. Indeed ninety per cent of all my BIF shots have been in focus and good to look at.

To prove to myself that I can do it, this morning I took some BIF shots using my Lumix FZ200 bridge camera. Even in the wind and rain I took thirty shots and twenty one were half decent.

However, you are perfectly correct, I need to learn a lot. My main problem is that due to intermittent and random health issues I can't get out nearly enough to consistently improve. I shall however not give up, just not with a Pentax and that really does make me sad.

As always, I can't thank all of you enough for your assistance et cetera, it really has been appreciated.
walt
Posted 21/10/2014 - 12:56 Link
Just a point about the M and TAV on my K-30, if you set Auto ISO in M mode it automatically drops into TAv mode and even reports it in EXIF. Which when you think about it is the same. Manual mode is only used if I set ISO to a single value.

Good luck with your new choice.
Walt
My newer photos google photos
My older Flickr photos Flickr
Even older ones Picasa
Edited by walt: 21/10/2014 - 12:57
walt
Posted 21/10/2014 - 13:02 Link
richandfleur wrote:
Gedski wrote:
Daronl,
Your post is of immense importance to myself. Yesterday my camera manifested two faults.

Out of interest, what were the faults please?

Mine has suffered from a weird mirror half lockup fault, twice now, very odd and cleared by shooting a few shots with no lenses attached.

The aperture motor has failed and was replaced under warranty. This was a full blown hardware fault which got progressively worse and worse.

And the camera randomly stops during the few times I've set up an interval shooting session for timelapse work. No error given, it just stops firing.

The last two above have turned out to be quite common unfortunately. I know other brands have issues, but for contrasts sake my K100d had no issues ever, other than a tendency to back focus a lot which I put down more to simply the stage of autofocus technology of the day. By contrast the K-30 focusses perfectly for me, given the right conditions, (ie not flying birds for a start!)

My K-30 hasn't been my most reliable Pentax either. I had a problem with the mirror stopping half way up/down and the camera would just lockup every now and then. SRS sent it back for me under warranty and the mirror/shutter assembly was replaced along with some system board and johnstons photopia (the UK pentax repair centre I believe) did a great job recalibrating.
Walt
My newer photos google photos
My older Flickr photos Flickr
Even older ones Picasa
DrOrloff
Posted 21/10/2014 - 13:19 Link
Gedski wrote:
Boy do I need help, please. Forgive the preamble but it does serve a point. Using a Canon 700D, for birds in flight shots, I just put the shutter speed to +/- 1000th and fired away and got a lot of good shots.

Right thought I, just do the same with the K-50 and Bob's me uncle. Wrong! As you can see from the blackbird shot in my gallery, that is not a very good shot but it is about the best that I managed. I went from 800th to 1600th and it got no better. Most of the bird shots were too dark and some weren't in focus. My 55-300mm new type lens hunted an awful lot.

The flower shot is far too dark and like my bird shots I couldn't find any way to get the picture at an acceptable brightness. The weather has and still is a very sunny, and bright day. So why am I struggling or should I have stuck with the 700D. Please don't say yes! Both shots are in my gallery and the wildlife one.

Jan.

These may be of interest as they are similar subjects taken with a similar setup and at similar settings. Pentax K5 and DA55-300. Respectively 1/1600th, 1/1000th and 1/800th. I certainly think the 55-300 is an adequate lens, especially for the price. Autofocus has improved since my K5 but nonetheless I think it's ok - I found the opposite to you, the keeper rate being high. I mostly use my camera on manual setttings in any case now, as I think I can guess the settings better than the camera can. My advice would be to use whatever you are most comfortable with as that plays a big part. If you think what you are using is inferior then the results will be inferior as frustration will override technique. I have though seen a few photographers switch brand because of frustration for one reason or another. They invariably think that the new kit is much better. Sometimes it is, especially where a vast injection of cash is involved. Mostly though I think they are under a misapprehension and their results remain about the same. In the worst case the 'upgrade' leads to more frustration and the hobby goes out the window.

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Here's a 100% crop for those that enjoy a little pixel peep. It could be better, but how much better does it need to be? Incremental benefits get very expensive so for regularly incomed amateur togs there has to be a 'that'll do' point.

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I found that at 300mm then the 55-300 didn't handle strong contrast that well - it gave smeary edges with bright whites so that could be an issue for bird photography. So my that'll do point came with the DA*300. It gives me excellent results that I don't see need to be any sharper - they are simply good enough, certainly for what my eyes can resolve.

Good luck with whatever you end up using.
Edited by DrOrloff: 21/10/2014 - 13:21
dcweather
Posted 22/10/2014 - 23:47 Link
michaelblue wrote:
I worked with a professional wildlife photographer for a day and his best advice for photographing flying birds was "If the bird is against a clear sky use as many focus points as you have, if the bird is against a background (trees, grass etc. then stick to centre point autofocus and try to stay on the bird" Obvious when you think about it but not until he told us Since that piece of advice my 'keeper' rate has increased

------------------------------------------
Sound advice and something I'd thought about. All I need now is to tell the bird not to fly high or low depending on which setting I've got

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