360° feedback

Hi there
I really like PU and I like to post pictures and get feedback (and when I have time, looking at other pictures and provide feedback). However - I miss somehow that people also say, what they don't like on a picture. My experience is, good feedback is great for the ego, but critical (AND constructive) feedback is great to improve the photographic skills. It was mainly critical feedback in picture forums, that helped me to improve my photographic skills.

I know from myself, how difficult it is, to tell somebody, that something in his/her photo is not ideal. You don't want to disappoint someone, you don't want to do it in a forum and you want to be unpolite…. At least, I often prefer not to comment at all, instead of saying, what I dislike at a picture. The problem is – when no one speaks out the negative things, how should I improve my pictures.
I don't want to promote rude or inappropriate comments such as “Hey – your picture is absolutely rubbish” what I mean is to give a very personal opinion why something appears bad and ideally offer a proposal, how to do it better. At the end, photography is a matter of subjective opinions – so when receiving such a feedback, a photographer can still decide, if he agrees or if he prefers the way how he originally made the picture.

As it might still be difficult to give critical feedback in a public category, here a proposal. There should be a category that is called something like “Hard but fair” (I am not an EN native – I am sure some of you might have far better name proposals ). The character of this category is, that people submitting pictures in it, want to hear 360° feedback – they want to hear, what others like but also, what others do not like. Those that give feedback ideally suggest how they would have taken the same picture, what they would have done differently to achieve a better result. This category would be a nice place for newbies (when starting with photography, you typically do certain things wrong and hearing critical feedback might de-motivate you – but in such a category you are requesting critical feedback, hence it does not de-motivate). It would also be an opportunity for more experienced photographers, when they have a picture, that they themselves see critical (that has something, that seems to be wrong, but you can’t figure out what it is), or it is a great category for very polarizing, provoking, unorthodox, artworks, or when an experienced photographer tries out new areas of photography (like his first macros, his first HDRs or tilt-shift or portrait pictures). Uploading it in this category ensures , that it will be picked to pieces and you can take these pieces, re-arrange them, replace some and suddenly you have a better picture
Just a proposal – if you don’t like it or think, it is not needed as you already provide critical feedback, also fine with me
Axel

Well put Axel! I tend not to comment if I don't like a picture. However I do try and make a constructive comment to help improve a picture that I do like!

I wonder if what you propose is what ePz is trying to achieve with the option of uploading a photo, and disabling the voting on it to encourage constructive critical feedback.

Whether a new category is needed as you suggest, I don't know; maybe just greater encouragement to members to be honest and constructive.

On a more general note, I do sense that people are less able to take criticism and take it as rejection. That is not aimed at anyone in particular here - just a general observation.

Andy

I would agree with you.

The ephotozine site has a Critic Gallery, I think this is what you are after :

http://www.ephotozine.com/critique-gallery

There comments like 'nice pic' and 'good shot' are banned, and actual critique of a photo is required.

The Gallery here is simply for sharing, though a lot of us use it as a testing ground.

If you want hard critique, you can always say so when you post an image. Be careful what you ask for!

Hi John - not sure if I understood you - you mean being careful when uploading a picture and ask for 360° feedback or asking for such a category?

Hi Sean - I didn't knew ephotozine - will have a look - thanks for the hint......

I always try and offer constructive feedback on images posted on PU, if there is any aspect I think can be improved I will say so, and I would expect it in return.

I dont think theres anything wrong with anyone saying "nice" etc, many people are unsure of what makes a good image themselves but still want to offer their appreciation of other peoples work, and if it gives them something to say and be a participating member of the forum then whats the problem.

Hmmm it seems I was missunderstood - yes I aggree - it is important to say nice things as well - it is just a gut feeling that negative feedback is not happeining that often. If you look at the galleries and go to a picture that has a low quality (for whatever reason - sharpness, composition, lights, contrasts,etc.), it often has no feedback at all. I made similar experience in the fotocommunity.de - this is the biggest community in Germany but I left it as after a while, you either received no feedback or nice feedback. Some members gave constructive feedback but only some. Was just wondering, if this would be different in a specific category and the fact that ephotozine has such a category might be the result of the same observation they made there?

There is a lack of feedback, good or bad. Often we look at photos and then move on. You just need to look at the number of views v the number of replies to see this. I'm as guilty of this as anyone and must do better moving forward

I think this is right. The PU Gallery, is a very casual place. So much so if you get any comment at all you should pleased as someone has taken the trouble to highlight their enjoyment, while no doubt clicking through a lot of images.

Again, ask for CC when you post or posting images to the forum and asking for critique is another way to go

I would give you CC Axel, but you never post anything s**t - LOL

when i make a constructive comment they have a go at me if you look at my passed some hate me lol

Hi Axel,

you are so right. I posted the same comment on my own pictures after just this sort of welcome but only ego boosting feedback. So far ive had no response. There is also a member who quite often only posts smilies as comments on my pictures!!

I am as guilty as everyone else of looking at a picture and posting nothing, whether or not i like it or not. I do try however to encourage those new to photography and offer advice where it's needed(not that i don't need it)

you do need good or bad to improve on pictures if not people think there ok when there not so i do give good and bad

This is another reason why I think a hard but fair category makes sense - when I go there to look at pictures - I am more encouraged to say something - just skipping or doing one word comments is not so likely)

For me anybody posting their images is wasting their time if they dont want constructive, honest feedback no matter how harsh it is. Otherwise it is an exercise in vanity and ego massage.

It is frustating as somebody relatively new to photography when you get 50 views but no comments. You assume that your images are just a bit ordinary- although sometimes it seems longer standing members get comments on some pretty average images!

I'd much rather be hung drawn and quartered than hear nothing.

We are all big girls and boys on the forum and should be able to take it on the chin.

When I post some images feel free to be BRUTAL!