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Police at it again.

Sdeve
Posted 26/02/2010 - 19:14 Link
After all the publicity about photographers and the Terrorism Act, after circulars from the Home Office telling the police that people taking photographs is actually legal, yet another incident where a police officer exercises powers that don't exist. What is happening to the police that a police officer can be unleashed on the public when he doesn't know the law, and is so uncertain of his own place in society that he cannot cope with a member of the public telling him, quite correctly, 'No'.

clicky

As if to add insult to injury, in the video clip, the officer even gets the powers he was trying to (ab)use wrong!

I'm not police bashing in the sense that I am particularly criticising this officer. What sort of incompetent, stupid, obnoxious, management is letting them out on the streets like this?
Father Ted
Posted 26/02/2010 - 19:18 Link
Yep, this one cropped up last week
Getting there! Thanks to you guys

Pentax K10d, *istDL, Kit lens ( 18-55mm ), 50mm f1.7 lens, Tamron 70-300mm lens, Prinzflex 70-162 manual lens, Various old flashes.
Technoblurb
Posted 26/02/2010 - 19:24 Link
This one was on the local news tonight link
Hardgravity
Posted 26/02/2010 - 19:47 Link
I work in the public domain as a Park Ranger, when I approach photographers they ALWAYS assume I'm going to tell them off or demand they stop using their kit.

When I talk about the camera and point out photo opportunities they leave with a grin on their faces.

Why do idiot security men and police officers have to be so heavy handed and aggressive?

It does nobody any favours and only undermines any respect we, the public, have left for them.
Cheers, HG

K110+DA40, K200+DA35, K3 and a bag of lenses, bodies and other bits.

Mustn't forget the Zenits, or folders, or...

PPG entries.
Argee
Posted 26/02/2010 - 19:52 Link
Sdeve wrote:
What is happening to the police that a police officer can be unleashed on the public when he doesn't know the law, and is so uncertain of his own place in society that he cannot cope with a member of the public telling him, quite correctly, 'No'.

What sort of incompetent, stupid, obnoxious, management is letting them out on the streets like this?

The main reason, of course, is the training methods used - in turn introduced to relieve the Home Office of a huge financial burden. The first line supervisors have been in the system as PCs since the inception of the UEA-style "training," so it's not surprising that we're now seeing those faults further up the chain of command.

Until 1989, all officers were trained in the same way and all were subject to the same examinations whilst undergoing initial training. Failure in a number of those exams meant a return to Force (IOW, the sack). Then the UEA convinced the Home Office that the way forward was via "student-centred" learning, where students were encouraged to bring their own life experiences into the classroom. Rows of desks were replaced by semi-circles of chairs and the instructors became "trainers" overnight - sitting with the students at what was known as a "low-level intervention."

Exam results swiftly took a tumble and Forces were horrified at how many recruits were potential "returns to Force" wastes of space. The solution - easy - do away with the exams. Now, the norm became not "train and test," but "make aware and assess." The recruit could not "fail" an assessment, only require "further development" in order to prevent recruit wastage, no doubt.

Requirements for promotion consisted of a National three-paper examination, both at PC - Sgt. and Sgt. - Inspector levels. Promotion thereafter was at Force level interviews. Of course, the promotion examinations followed suit in 1992, changing to a multiple-choice single paper (tick-the-box), followed by an assessment centre "practical" assessment for those passing the first part. Officers were assessed by those from any other Force than their own, all assessors rigidly sticking to a script in the interests of "fairness." Of course, a rigidly-timed 5 minutes role-playing in a small room with a stone-faced actor is not the most practical or successful way of discovering potential, but that seemed to have been ignored ("King's New Clothes" syndrome).

The pass rate on this style of examination was pathetically low and after a few years of purgatory, it was decided to move the "practical" side to the Force concerned, assessed by a local officer one rank above the candidate's prospective rank. Of course, if you were a busy Station Inspector and were suddenly landed with any number of Divisional candidates all requiring evidenced assessment, you'd be able to fit all that extra work in easily, wouldn't you?

The Home Office completely handed off the residential training centres throughout the country and told Forces that they had to provide these facilities on Division - the Division to which the new recruit would be posted. So, instead of each Force providing a small number of staff on secondment to their local regional centre (where their officers attended) and the Home Office paying for the premises and wages of the seconded staff, Forces now had the plug completely pulled and immediately ran into problems.

No Divisions had a training centre complex ready and waiting and most police HQ or Divisional buildings didn't have a square inch of space to build any. Deals were done with local Colleges and Universities to use their premises and the whole thing swiftly became a cat's breakfast. Police Authorities took the view that having their recruits trained at Uni was kudos in the public eye and left it alone.

I say this not to excuse the current dismal level of officer training, but to explain the likely cause. I'm not seeking sympathy for the current generation of Patrol Officers, all of whom have a personal responsibility for their own development and training. However, with all the beauraucracy and extra paperwork, coupled with the disastrous introduction of PCSOs, I can see why many don't burn the midnight oil.

Ray
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bwlchmawr
Posted 26/02/2010 - 20:02 Link
Policing is only possible by consensus.

You know the real dangers here guys, is that users of this forum are, I imagine, for the most part, a bunch of cool, sane, "normal", well balanced, naturally law-abiding, moderate folk. The way the police are behaving is in danger of alienating us.

And that's a bad thing.

Regards,

Andrew
Best wishes,

Andrew

"These places mean something and it's the job of a photographer to figure-out what the hell it is."
Robert Adams
"The camera doesn't make a bit of difference.  All of them can record what you are seeing.  But, you have to SEE."
Ernst Hass
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Dangermouse
Posted 27/02/2010 - 00:10 Link
Thing is, the "proper coppers" would agree with us. I read the Inspector Gadget blog on a regular basis and he more or less says the same thing - the management speak and target-chasing are ruining policing and losing the confidence of the law-abiding general public.

Now, I know someone who used to be a PCSO (she'd have been one of the better ones, especially where photographer's rights are concerned as she's since become a semi-pro photographer), it's a pretty rough job as people expect you to do wonders when you have no more power of arrest than a normal person. That said, I've heard a few tales of the airhead she was sent on patrol with who would apparently say that cars passing at 30mph were "speeding" because she was useless at judging speeds...
Matt

Shooting the Welsh Wilderness with K-m, KX, MX, ME Super and assorted lenses.
Edited by Dangermouse: 27/02/2010 - 00:13
Lloydy
Posted 27/02/2010 - 00:35 Link
'Agree' tells us a lot of things that I suspect most of the "cool, sane, "normal", well balanced, naturally law-abiding, moderate folk." didn't know, but now that it's been pointed out to us, we aren't really surprised because so many of us are also living in a "management speak and target-chasing" world that seems ( to me anyway ) to be making less sense every single day.

Sadly, the Home Office ( or whoever is now in charge of Police ) will be able to issue copious amounts of coloured graphs and charts that 'prove' the changes are working very successfully and saving millions of pounds. And who are we to argue with an authoritative person armed with graphs and charts?

Take the coloured pencils away from the idiots, and then see what they can prove!

( I get more like a Daily Mail reader every day )
Father Ted
Posted 27/02/2010 - 20:42 Link
Dangermouse wrote:
Thing is, the "proper coppers" would agree with us. I read the Inspector Gadget blog on a regular basis and he more or less says the same thing - the management speak and target-chasing are ruining policing and losing the confidence of the law-abiding general public.

Knowing a couple of "propper coppers" (they'd like that tag ), I have to concur. They seem to have common sense in abundance.
Getting there! Thanks to you guys

Pentax K10d, *istDL, Kit lens ( 18-55mm ), 50mm f1.7 lens, Tamron 70-300mm lens, Prinzflex 70-162 manual lens, Various old flashes.

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