Does Pentax need a CHEAP DSLR......??


dangie

Link Posted 30/03/2018 - 17:24
All budding photography enthusiasts need to start somewhere. Mostly we start at the bottom of the equipment range and as experience improves move up to better models. Very few buy top of the range cameras at the outset,

Using WEX as an example for the cheapest dslr's + kit lens.
Canon EOS 1300 = £349
Nikon D3400 = £454
Sony Alpha A68 = £499

Pentax K-S2 = £679
Pentax K-70 = £729

Now ok, you may say "Ah but the Pentax is better than the other cheaper cameras...."

But to the total beginner it isn't. They are probably looking at price plus the fact they can get a Canon or Nikon far cheaper than Pentax. Plus once they have bought into the brand, that's probably where they'll stay.

So. Does Pentax need a cheap model to compete with Canon, Nikon & Sony to get beginners into the Pentax brand?
6th Year Apprentice Pensioner

danofmk

Link Posted 30/03/2018 - 18:05
I'd have to say yes

As a relative newcomer to this myself, when I got my K30 in 2014 I can tell you for sure regardless of any better features it may have had, I wouldn't have been spending those sort of extra sums to get going

With the KP I am not sure what the need is for the K70 to be so expensive. It's not a million miles away from the K30 anyway, so not sure why it's suddenly jumped away from the other entry level cameras from the competitors price wise

1stEverPentax

Link Posted 30/03/2018 - 18:27
Definitely a YES from me as well.

Pentax were far too hasty to do away with the K-500 / KS-1 without replacing them with something they could sell at the same sort of price level. Ultimately it will be the main reason for Pentax's demise in my view as there can't be many newcomers buying into the brand and the pitifully small user base they have is not sufficient to keep the brand afloat.

The purchase by SRS of ALL Pentax's European ex-demo/reconditioned stock plus the complete absence of any 'deals' on their new lenses (short of offering you 10% off if you buy 2!) at this crucial sales time is a sign of just how desperate things are.

One might argue that a decently priced entry level DSLR was more important for the future of the company than a new K3III.
Last Edited by 1stEverPentax on 30/03/2018 - 18:29

HarisF1

Link Posted 30/03/2018 - 20:03
People who want to buy a DSLR without doing the research will most likely pick something from Canikon, and unless Pentax start advertising properly they'll never break into the 'newbie DSLR' market.

The people that buy Pentax cameras are the type to go out and look for specific features such as WR and IBIS. And in that case the second hand market probably hurts Pentax a little. If Pentax come out with a camera at the £399 price point, will it be better than a used K-3 or a fairly clean K-S2? Even the K-70 can be found close to that price.

stub

Link Posted 30/03/2018 - 20:17
Well I'm going to throw a "NO" into the discussion.. I think the figures for this area of the market have shown that it is totally dominated by the mobile phone. And things will only get worse in the future. The modern generation are taking more pictures / video than they ever have before. But not with DSLR's. But once the mobile has generated an interest then the consumer will look for something more advanced,, Then they will look at more sophisticated models.

What Pentax really need is something compact that has wifi capability, A fun camera, to easily upload to the internet. along the Go Pro line. For blogging. But with Pentax video history maybe thats why they havnt bothered.
K-1Gripped K-1 ungripped K-5ii K7 Various lenses

Stuart..
Last Edited by stub on 30/03/2018 - 20:18

Algernon

Link Posted 30/03/2018 - 20:29
The camera mass market just isn't there anymore. The only way to survive is sell fewer cameras at much higher prices and hope that you can find enough enthusiasts to buy them. If that fails move onto other products.

Even a smartphone costs £600 plus these days. Apple don't even bother with the lower end of the computer market they can easily get big prices off the fanbuoys

It happened with the film cameras the cheaper brands Practica, Zenith, Chinon etc. just disappeared. I seem to remember Olympus more than doubled the price of their top 35mm body to about £1200 and Pentax did the same. Few people were willing to pay that much so production was stopped.

No one says Rolex should make cheaper watches

It's not April 1st for another two days!

--
Half Man... Half Pentax ... Half Cucumber

Pentax K-1 + K-5 and some other stuff

Algi
Last Edited by Algernon on 30/03/2018 - 20:32

dangie

Link Posted 30/03/2018 - 22:27
Algernon wrote:
....No one says Rolex should make cheaper watches....

No of course they don't, but Rolex is, like Leica, a prestige brand.

As good as Pentax is, it's not a prestige brand. It's a mass market brand.
6th Year Apprentice Pensioner

richandfleur

Link Posted 31/03/2018 - 01:12
HarisF1 wrote:
People who want to buy a DSLR without doing the research will most likely pick something from Canikon, and unless Pentax start advertising properly they'll never break into the 'newbie DSLR' market.

The people that buy Pentax cameras are the type to go out and look for specific features such as WR and IBIS.

I believe 4 other brands now offer IBIS so thatís not a Pentax only thing anymore. (All 4 work in video mode )

I agree though, that getting a foot in the door of a brand is powerful towards keeping customers there. Iím still with Pentax now mostly because Iíve got a kit bag that would be expensive to replace. Itís stupid really, as you will be unlikely to keep your kit lens on a much better body later on, but it works and people stay brand loyal.

We transitioned over from Pentax film into digital, but Iíd probably have been better served with another brand in the long term, because I just canít buy Pentax anything easily here in NZ. There is no Pentax shop in my city, but I can buy or order in pretty much any other brand easily.

Pentax doesnít advertise, and doesnít sell through the traditional outlets. How do they honestly expect anyone to find out about their stuff? I read magazines which often review Pentax (must give the likes of Digital DSLR Photography and Digital Camera credit for including them fairly) but apart from that, youíll never see reference to them elsewhere in the magazine articles.

The company does these stale video interviews with the US Pentax Forums, but then others do similar major interviews with real answers. Sigma lenses recently did an interview for DPReview and it was really interesting.

Agree though, canít see why the cheaper K-500 or K-S1 options were dropped so quickly. The K-S2 and K-70 were practically the same camera competing against each other, so one should have been placed lower and the other higher. Quite a wasted period that was really, trying to draw kids away from their phones by putting flashing lights on the camera.

Geez that all sounds really negative sorry.

HarisF1

Link Posted 31/03/2018 - 01:23
It's the truth and it's not going to help if it's hidden away in the back of our minds.

I got lucky that I bought into Pentax during a sale (no idea who they were apart from having bought a pair of Pentax binos) and don't see any reason to be using anything else, but I can imagine why a new buyer would buy anything BUT Pentax.

danofmk

Link Posted 31/03/2018 - 07:08
I'm afraid the younger generation brought up on their phones are put off getting into photography 'properly' due to the price; they're not wanting to go for high spec dslrs at 700 plus. If anything even 400 to 500 is too much for most

Jonathan-Mac

Link Posted 31/03/2018 - 08:36
I would say that yes, they do, but bear in mind that camera prices are rising and will continue to rise, due to lower sales volumes. Brexit and global economical instability will make matters worse but the era of really cheap DSLRs is gone and will not return. When it comes time to replace my K3 I expect to pay at least 20% more than I did for that camera.
Pentax hybrid user - Digital K3 & K200D, film 645 and 35mm SLR and Pentax (&other) lenses adapted to Fuji X digital
Fan of DA limited and old manual lenses

Algernon

Link Posted 31/03/2018 - 08:37
dangie wrote:
Algernon wrote:
....No one says Rolex should make cheaper watches....

No of course they don't, but Rolex is, like Leica, a prestige brand.

As good as Pentax is, it's not a prestige brand. It's a mass market brand.

Rollex is just one brand. Nearly all Swiss watches are priced very high.

The mass market no longer exists. In a few years high spec cameras will be mostly for the pro market.

Pentax have already tried to attract the yoof with multi-coloured and cartoon cameras..... Small Q's .... Flashing lights etc. Maybe they need a Gangsta cam

Cameras are far too complicated anyway due to users comparing tick lists and moaning this hasn't got this hasn't got that etc. I bought a K-1 three months ago and it's too complicated to use. The K-5 is much easier and from what I've seen better also available for £200 on the SH market.

In the 60's and 70's very few bought top marque cameras as their 1st SLR. They bought the cheaper brands and traded up. I went Aries Reflex...... Praktica.... Pentax.

Photography even when cheap is always perceived as expensive.... so you can forget about cheap. Even D&P in the film days was regarded as very expensive so you can't win on price.

Does anyone take into account that you no longer have to buy film? So the camera actually costs nothing when you look at the savings on film.
--
Half Man... Half Pentax ... Half Cucumber

Pentax K-1 + K-5 and some other stuff

Algi
Last Edited by Algernon on 31/03/2018 - 08:42

RobL

Link Posted 31/03/2018 - 08:54
With little idea of DSLRs I went to LCE with a Nikon in mind as I had fancied one when I was young and poor. Entry level models were a disappointment and felt cheap, for very little more I got a K50 plus kit lens for £399 which offered much more quality and a prism instead of mirrors. If the cheapest Pentax had been around £679 I would not be here now.
Last Edited by RobL on 31/03/2018 - 08:58

Algernon

Link Posted 31/03/2018 - 09:08
But you'll gladly pay £679 for a bloody phone

--
Half Man... Half Pentax ... Half Cucumber

Pentax K-1 + K-5 and some other stuff

Algi

Aitch53

Link Posted 31/03/2018 - 09:10
Do people pay for phones, or get them as part of their mobile phone contract?
SteveH!

Some people call me 'strange'.
I prefer 'unconventional'.
But I'm willing to compromise and accept 'eccentric'.
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