Coulsdon Common Woods
4,607 posts
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Posted 26/04/2020 - 19:17
Hi Nigel, good to see you posting again. Got to be honest here though, this does not work for me. Too dark with no discernible point of interest. Sorry
Peter
My Flickr page
Peter
My Flickr page
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Posted 26/04/2020 - 20:01
Welcome back again, Nigel. Let's hope this is the first of many new threads and images from you.
I see what you mean about it needing a black surround. Nevertheless it still seems rather too dark to me, and the JPEG histogram seems to show that you have a fair amount of leeway before anything will become too bright.
Philip
I see what you mean about it needing a black surround. Nevertheless it still seems rather too dark to me, and the JPEG histogram seems to show that you have a fair amount of leeway before anything will become too bright.
Philip
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Posted 26/04/2020 - 20:45
Nige...!! Brilliant to see you back...Ii
Thought you and me were the very last of the K7 owners. Using mine again this week. As both my K1's have developed faults... I wont comment on your image. It's not really my cup of tea.. Thought we were "portrait" men....lol
But It brings up an interesting question..... ? In the modern era, Can a K7 out perform a mobile phone.. ?
Yes I appreciate it's a bit of a generalisation as to which. why and where..! But I would be interested to know the members thoughts...?
Or maybe I should start a new thread..?
K-1Gripped K-1 ungripped K-5ii K7 Various lenses
Stuart..
Thought you and me were the very last of the K7 owners. Using mine again this week. As both my K1's have developed faults... I wont comment on your image. It's not really my cup of tea.. Thought we were "portrait" men....lol
But It brings up an interesting question..... ? In the modern era, Can a K7 out perform a mobile phone.. ?
Yes I appreciate it's a bit of a generalisation as to which. why and where..! But I would be interested to know the members thoughts...?
Or maybe I should start a new thread..?
K-1Gripped K-1 ungripped K-5ii K7 Various lenses
Stuart..
Last Edited by stub on 26/04/2020 - 20:47
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Posted 26/04/2020 - 21:02
Thanks for jumping in with your comments guys, and it looks like I'll have to try and climb the trees to get nearer the sun, and brighten things up for my next one! It is very dark and eerie down there in those woods.....
Stu, I've looked at quite a good number of similar images taken with the K7 and my Huawei phone, and firstly the JPEG processing is certainly better from the phone. But we're talking about software and technologies that are 10 years apart, so I think that's to be expected, and a company like Huawei has obviously been pumping huge sums into image processing development in the quest to sell more phones.
But once I look at the core IQ issues, especially resolution and clarity, there's no competition.... The K7 wins hands down. Zooming in on a phone photo reveals a mushy weird texture... Zooming in on a k7 image reveals every fine detail imaginable.
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver
Stu, I've looked at quite a good number of similar images taken with the K7 and my Huawei phone, and firstly the JPEG processing is certainly better from the phone. But we're talking about software and technologies that are 10 years apart, so I think that's to be expected, and a company like Huawei has obviously been pumping huge sums into image processing development in the quest to sell more phones.
But once I look at the core IQ issues, especially resolution and clarity, there's no competition.... The K7 wins hands down. Zooming in on a phone photo reveals a mushy weird texture... Zooming in on a k7 image reveals every fine detail imaginable.
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver
Last Edited by McGregNi on 26/04/2020 - 21:03
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Posted 26/04/2020 - 21:22
That's good to know Nigel.. I'm not much of a phone guy... Just about send a text...Lol But you dont have to carry around extra lenses or purchase them for that matter.. So its more than just image quality. Though granted they have to be in the same ballpark... ?
K-1Gripped K-1 ungripped K-5ii K7 Various lenses
Stuart..
K-1Gripped K-1 ungripped K-5ii K7 Various lenses
Stuart..
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Posted 26/04/2020 - 21:49
For everyday family shots out and about, with fairly even lighting, then the phone is good enough. I still edit the shots to control contrasts and bring out faces for example, and for that Google Photos or Snapseed are very good. Indoors the phone struggles more, where often bright light from outside brings contrast challenges that are impossible to surmount.
So the DSLR is still king for me, no doubt about it. Its just a pity that for me lately I have not been able to get the necessary time and focus on using the DSLR system effectively, so have resorted to a compromise solution to at least keep documenting things in my life.
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver
So the DSLR is still king for me, no doubt about it. Its just a pity that for me lately I have not been able to get the necessary time and focus on using the DSLR system effectively, so have resorted to a compromise solution to at least keep documenting things in my life.
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver
Last Edited by McGregNi on 26/04/2020 - 21:50
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Posted 27/04/2020 - 08:29
I guess it's because the resolution figure for phone "cameras" (as they call them) is very high now.... We see crazy numbers like 48mp regularly advertised. This seems to lead to very detailed images, at least in decent light, and when viewed on a screen.
I haven't found myself that the images hold up to much close inspection. Night shots on my phone look good initially at normal size on the phone screen, but when enlarged the jagged and pixellated effects become obvious.
The main limitation I have found, and which will always keep me wanting the DSLR again, is dynamic range.... My 1 year old phone struggles considerably with contrast, especially highlights, where the 11 year old K7 would cope with ease.
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver
I haven't found myself that the images hold up to much close inspection. Night shots on my phone look good initially at normal size on the phone screen, but when enlarged the jagged and pixellated effects become obvious.
The main limitation I have found, and which will always keep me wanting the DSLR again, is dynamic range.... My 1 year old phone struggles considerably with contrast, especially highlights, where the 11 year old K7 would cope with ease.
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver
Last Edited by McGregNi on 27/04/2020 - 08:31
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Posted 27/04/2020 - 13:34
Its very dark and kudos for not stressing about clipping those shadows and "going there".
Like others have said, the lack of something for the eye to fall on naturally through the frame is the killer in the shot such as someone sat there on the logs
Gareth
Welsh Photographer
My outfit: K1 gripped - K3ii - two Z-1P - Pentax D FA 24-70mm - Sigma 70-200mm OS HSM - Pentax modified DA* 60-250mm f4 - Irix 15mm Firefly - Pentax FA 35mm - FA 50mm - Sigma EX 20mm - FA 28-70mm f4 - Tamron SP 90mm macro - Pentax AF 540 FGZ II
My Flickr
My PPG
Foundation NFT
Like others have said, the lack of something for the eye to fall on naturally through the frame is the killer in the shot such as someone sat there on the logs
Gareth
Welsh Photographer
My outfit: K1 gripped - K3ii - two Z-1P - Pentax D FA 24-70mm - Sigma 70-200mm OS HSM - Pentax modified DA* 60-250mm f4 - Irix 15mm Firefly - Pentax FA 35mm - FA 50mm - Sigma EX 20mm - FA 28-70mm f4 - Tamron SP 90mm macro - Pentax AF 540 FGZ II
My Flickr
My PPG
Foundation NFT
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Posted 28/04/2020 - 15:26
Welcome back, Nigel. Good to hear from you again. I agree that your woodland shot looks better with a black surround - but it's still very dark! I flirted with using my mobile phone as my "walkabout" camera and trying to do more serious things with it, but came to much the same conclusions as you. I have since bought a mirrorless compact camera with a micro 4/3 sensor and a standard range Leica zoom lens and I'm blown away by the way in which this little camera gives my K-5 a run for its money in many aspects of image quality. I'm not quite ready to sell my soul completely to M4/3, but I am using my K-5 a lot less these days.
Regards,
Mike
Every day's a holiday!
Regards,
Mike
Every day's a holiday!
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Posted 28/04/2020 - 16:33
Hello again, Nigel. Has a bit of confusion arisen in this thread or (perhaps more likely) is it just my mistaken impression? I was assuming that the image in your first post is from your K-7 and that you have only recently processed it on your phone? The thread didn't appear to me to set out to compare the relative merits of a DSLR and a phone camera for capturing images?
Philip
Philip
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Posted 28/04/2020 - 21:44
Hello Mike, thanks for your welcome! I know there's plenty of demand for lighter and smaller interchangeable lens type systems, but I hope the demand for DSLRs does not drop away too much more, as we want to keep being offered a full range of choices. From what you wrote above I can safely surmise that you will not be in the market for the new D FA 85mm lens ..... ?
Hi again Philip, yes I should clarify .... the image is taken on the K7, in DNG format, and processed using the Snapseed App on the Huawei phone. As I've said in my last couple of posts I am not finding time to spend on the PC anymore, so am resorting to a mobile workflow, which is satisfying my appetite for now.
I think the comparison discussion re mobile phones / DSLRs came out of my comment that I am using the phone for convenience while I am not using my DSLR kit, although it is always going to be a compromise solution.
I keep my interest in photography alive by maintaining a proper workflow for my images, both older ones from the K7 and other digital cameras I had before that, as well as new shots from the phone. By using an Android device I can create a full and detailed file system with full sized and web sized versions of images, as well as manage a phone / Laptop / USB Drive backup plan, and save to multiple cloud services as well. So those tasks satisfy my photographic urges to an extent.
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver
Hi again Philip, yes I should clarify .... the image is taken on the K7, in DNG format, and processed using the Snapseed App on the Huawei phone. As I've said in my last couple of posts I am not finding time to spend on the PC anymore, so am resorting to a mobile workflow, which is satisfying my appetite for now.
I think the comparison discussion re mobile phones / DSLRs came out of my comment that I am using the phone for convenience while I am not using my DSLR kit, although it is always going to be a compromise solution.
I keep my interest in photography alive by maintaining a proper workflow for my images, both older ones from the K7 and other digital cameras I had before that, as well as new shots from the phone. By using an Android device I can create a full and detailed file system with full sized and web sized versions of images, as well as manage a phone / Laptop / USB Drive backup plan, and save to multiple cloud services as well. So those tasks satisfy my photographic urges to an extent.
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver
Last Edited by McGregNi on 28/04/2020 - 21:46
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Posted 29/04/2020 - 00:32
Nigel, I had another look at this image and it certainly has a "painterly" feel to it. On reflection I believe I was wrong to think it was too dark overall. I took the liberty of doing some selective dodging and burning to emphasise the trunks in the foreground and darken the background even more so as to emphasise the former. Let me know what you think.
On opening the image I noticed immediately it has no colour profile at all. On any browser without colour management (and even some with) will not display the image correctly due to this. Perhaps you need to look at your workflow to amend this.
Anyway here is my edited version in sRGB colour space......
Peter
My Flickr page
On opening the image I noticed immediately it has no colour profile at all. On any browser without colour management (and even some with) will not display the image correctly due to this. Perhaps you need to look at your workflow to amend this.
Anyway here is my edited version in sRGB colour space......
Peter
My Flickr page
Last Edited by pschlute on 29/04/2020 - 00:34
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Posted 29/04/2020 - 21:53
Nigel, I find your image quite all right, very moody and atmostpheric. Not too dark at all - I'd even emphasize the darkness like Peter did above, although I wouldn't brighten the logs in the foreground as he did (well, maybe just a touch, but nothing drastic).
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McGregNi
Member
Surrey, England
I've not yet got back to using the K7, but I hope it will come one day again. I'm still working through the back catalogue using Snapseed on the phone, and heres one I liked taken a few years ago and given a new lease of life from its DNG storage case....
It was probably taken with the DFA 28-105mm, and a decent amount of underexposure to keep the speckled highlight hotspots under control.
If you can I would try to view it with black surrounds......
My Guides to the Pentax Digital Camera Flash Lighting System : Download here from the PentaxForums Homepage Article .... link
Pentax K7 with BG-4 Grip / Samyang 14mm f2.8 ED AS IF UMC / DA18-55mm f3.5-5.6 AL WR / SMC A28mm f2.8 / D FA 28-105mm / SMC F35-70 f3.5-4.5 / SMC A50mm f1.7 / Tamron AF70-300mm f4-5.6 Di LD macro / SMC M75-150mm f4.0 / Tamron Adaptall (CT-135) 135mm f2.8 / Asahi Takumar-A 2X tele-converter / Pentax AF-540FGZ (I & II) Flashes / Cactus RF60/X Flashes & V6/V6II Transceiver