Amazon Lightning Deals...Predatory Pricing?

Another Christmas and another Amazon Lightning Deal...

Does anyone know where Amazon are sourcing this stock from? For the next 3 hours they have the Pentax K-S2 + 18-135WR lens for an unbelievable £484! To put this in context Pentax Pro dealers like SRS, Park Cameras et al are currently selling it for typically £700 give or take a few quid.

I appreciate that buying off a Pro dealer gives a 2 year warranty, but really the cost of an extra year on this package should only be an extra £20-£25 or so .

What is going on? the options are:

1. Amazon is selling Grey stock imported from outside the EU (but presumably with Ricoh's consent)

2. Amazon is selling official EU stock at bargain basement prices. I can't believe they are not making a profit on this...which begs the question why is the price gap not much lower between Amazon and Pentax Pro dealers. Even outside these Lightning deals Amazon often undercuts the Pro dealers by more than the reduced cost of an extra years warranty.

Are the Pro dealers ripping us off or is Amazon not paying import tax/duties on the stuff it sells? If this is the case why are HMRC not doing something about it.

I like a bargain as much as the next person but NOT if it means that our specialist photo dealers are put out of business and the only retailer left is Amazon...just in time for the new TransAtlantic trade deal being negotiated in secret between the EU and the US.

What are other peoples thoughts on this?

Everything sold in the EU has 2 year warranty. It's the law. No external terms and conditions can change that. AS for deals - the bigger you are the more likely you can afford to sell without or with tiny profit to draw customers in - and that is all they are doing.

We bought a bunch of KS2 for company use in the summer in the Middle East for less than 400 quid a pop from the official local Pentax distributor. Customs in Kuwait are 4% and there are no taxes. I'm sure the store made a decent profit on the cameras - they are not a charity. That gives us an idea of the price they pay for stock.

It will be the same for Amazon I'd imagine.

I don't know the answer to the questions in the OP but I know of 2 dealers who no longer stock Pentax in part due to the Amazon "Pentax Specials" that have appeared over the last few years. Some high street retailers have experienced very slow trade over the last few weeks (presumably a reaction to Black Friday, Cyber Monday, Amazon Avalanche, etc.), although it does appear to be picking up now

There will always be offers, it works both ways, and SRS have been/are considerably less expensive than Amazon on quite a few Pentax lines.

As it's not a regular price, I would suggest Amazon have done a deal on a large amount of stock at an advantageous price.

Recently SRS did the same with the K-3 II.

I understood that there are negligible margins on cameras these days so presumably a deal has been reached with Ricoh on a batch much like the occasional special deals on lenses offered by dealers. Nikon has just reported shrinking sales for their cameras for the second (or maybe third) year which is key to their more lucrative aftersales market - lenses, flash etc. Is this an example of Ricoh's marketing strategy to achieve their stated aim of becoming no. 3 in DSLR sales? This strategy might be ok for attracting new Pentax customers but for existing it diminishes the value of their equipment, and it is really galling to see items you have already bought being sold for such a huge discount.

Another thing - we tend to equate the cost of something with quality and Leica rely on this with their control over retail prices, and as a result your Leica camera will retain a good second-hand value. You don't see this with other manufacturers so they sometimes need to boost their trade-in prices with special offers. If something is cheap to buy then is it any good? Should I therefore look elsewhere - that would be my response to this very short-sighted strategy.

I am patiently waiting for the new FF camera, but whatever it costs there will now be the question, how overpriced is it and when will be the first big price drop? So, this discounting might give a quick shot in the arm to quarterly sales figures but is more likely to harm sales in the long term.

From what I have gathered dealers like SRS to some extent have minimum prices set by Ricoh, the idea being that then more stores can see a profit when selling Pentax so hopefully more stores will then stock Pentax and the brand will become more popular

Amazon are a law onto themselves so these rules dont apply to them

There's also the possibility that these are just lossleaders. As in items at very low prices so people buy other items during their visit which makes amazon profit. Quite a common tactic.

Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that Amazon only gave 12 months warranty.


This is my concern, and i'm sure that after this year others will stop selling Pentax, further reducing choice for the consumer. Once the trade has gone to Amazon that transaction is gone, the money has been spent. I've no problem with fair competition but am concerned that Amazon is distorting the UK market to its advantage through unfair competition.
[/quote]One off deals are a possibility John...its just strange that Amazon seem to 'bag' the middle ground with the 18-135s attached...same last year with their K50/18-135 deal. Other Pentax dealers might as well flag up their websites that it isn't worth their while selling these products as Amazon have 'cornered' the market yet again.

Also John the Amazon deal isn't just a few quid off the Pentax Pro Dealer price...it murders it so much it leaves the impression that for the other 360 days of the year or so Ricoh is over-charging its customers massively. £403.33 + VAT today but if you weren't quick enough or had the cash to hand then you will have to pay £582.50 + VAT tomorrow at Park Cameras or Wex Photographic...even more at SRS. They must think we're complete muppets.

Much as I like Pentax branded products, the way that Ricoh are treating potential customers is really beginning to grate.

That's very interesting Mag07..thanks for that. Does it apply to literally every consumer good (that's not a grey import) or just consumer electronics?

The downside is ironically that for Pentax Pro dealers (and similar status other brands) it is one more nail in their coffin. I would be prepared to pay slightly more to support a Pro Dealer when comparing two identical products...even now after what you have just told me...but given the huge disparity in pricing we are talking about here comparing like for like (both with a 2 yr warranty) it can only be a matter of time before its just not profitable at all for dealers to sell one make or another due to Amazon abusing their market position.

Ricoh may have to increase their warranty to 3 years like Sigma or 5 years like Tamron or Samyang if they want to stay in business through their Pro dealership.

P.S. Before I forget i'll make a note of Directive No. 1999/44/EC for future reference!

Not as black and while as Mag07 suggests. This from the O2 web site;

EU directive 1999/44/EC

An EU Directive is making shoppers feel like they have extra rights to return faulty goods for up to two years. It's not quite that simple. Read our guide to see if it can help you. The EU directive in question is 1999/44/EC.

This EU Directive has been the source of much confusion amongst retailers and consumers alike since its publication. The UK only implemented some parts and not the entire Directive into its domestic law. This was done in the form of The Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002.

The Directive was introduced to give consumers across Europe the same level of basic rights regardless of which member state they live or shop in. For instance the Directive states that all member states have to give their consumers a TWO year period within which they could bring a legal claim against the retailer from whom they purchased the goods. This is known as the two year limitation period and is quite different from a "guarantee" (that is provided by a manufacturer with their terms and conditions) which it is often being confused with. The limitation periods in the UK are SIX years in England, Wales and Northern Ireland; and FIVE years from discovery in Scotland. In this respect UK law is far more generous than the EU Directive.

As the Directive does not REPLACE or NEGATE the long established rights that UK consumers have under the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended), the two systems run parallel to each other and a consumer can choose which they follow in dealing with their dispute. Therefore, consumers in the UK have the statutory right to expect goods that they purchase to Comply with the Contract and be of satisfactory quality, as described and fit for purpose.

The Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002 says that when a consumer seeks the remedies of repair, replacement, partial refund or full refund, in the first 6 months from the date of purchase, it is up to the retailer to prove that the goods conformed with the contract at that time. After the 6 months, however, it is for the customer to prove their goods were faulty at the time they made the purchase.


I'm not sure whether the recent Consumer Rights Act 2015 has changed the above.

Hmm...as you say JohnX...all down to interpretation. My interpretation though would be that If I had spent several hundred pounds on a camera or lens that went faulty after less than two years then it definitely wasn't fit for purpose or of merchantable quality...and the rest of the EU agree!

In the interests of being more ecologically friendly and encouraging longer ownership of stuff i'd suggest to politicians that EVERY electrical/electronic consumer item costing over say £500 should be required by law to come with a 5 year manufacturers warranty...many do last this long anyway so its not that unreasonable as some may argue. Would help to do away with some of the 'lemons' out there though.

Hi all, this is at least the third time they've had this offer on Amazon UK since Black Friday week.

My son Adam ordered one and it comes in legit packaging for bundle with lens in photo on box too. Either there are huge numbers being dumped or they are not selling even at this price. As someone who paid full price for the lens originally this does seem an incredibly low price.

My son by the way sent it back and decided to stick to his K3 as I suggested.

I bought my d600 from Amazon in January 2014 for £599 delivered. All those sold where customer returns. Still registered ok with the manufacture for two years warranty, so I guess these Pentax kits could be a similar customer returns which need shifting quickly.

My sons order of a KS2 and bundled officially 18 to 135mm was certainly not a repackaged return. All bags were sealed and everything pristine. Camera was unset for use and showing no shutter count. Now its a return of course