Who needs AI sharpening...
Posted 01/10/2023 - 22:33
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I like these!!
But... AI Denoise and Sharpening are not demons. It depends how hard you hit them. Some can over do it and make things look unatural, I find not over doing it works best. Especially for the sharpening!
I use and prefer AI DeNoise more myself.
But... AI Denoise and Sharpening are not demons. It depends how hard you hit them. Some can over do it and make things look unatural, I find not over doing it works best. Especially for the sharpening!
I use and prefer AI DeNoise more myself.
Posted 01/10/2023 - 23:51
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Lovely work here, soft and yet clear. What did you do?
Be well, stay safe, but most of all, invest in memories
Posted 02/10/2023 - 11:13
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Thanks.
2. Choose the lens. From past experience I knew that the FA77 with a short tube could do this sort of thing. For the ultimate in sharpness I'd have used a macro lens.
3. Choose a fairly wide aperture (f3.2 as it happens, I thought it was f2.8!). Guaranteed very shallow DOF so almost everything in the picture would necessarily be soft.
4. Choose the light. Foliage surrounding a flower or bud would give a green cast to the light, which seems to help with giving a feeling of softness. (I first discovered the effect of reflected green light when the underside of a low flying skylark appeared strangely green in a photo. Never forgot that one!)
5. Hand held, manual focus (no AF with a tube so no option :wink, body (mine, not the camera) in strange positions (). Almost guaranteed to ensure nothing would be razor sharp. For ultimate sharpness the tripod would have been used.
6. Evolve towards the right picture. These weren't the first buds and flowers photographed in that session. It started with a red fuchsia but that didn't seem to work so went to pink and worked through several flowers and buds until light, background, surrounding foliage etc. looked right. Then I tried some more and didn't find any better.
7. Use what's there to advantage. The green haze over most of the lower part of the first photo is from a leaf that was very close to the lens and protruding part-way across it. Moving it out of the way did cross my mind (I prefer not to remove bits of plants unless absolutely essential) but the view through the viewfinder suggested otherwise. So really just a bit of luck that a leaf turned up in the unexpectedly right place - sometimes luck is on your side .
8. Don't show the shots that didn't work...
Steve
Urbanmeister wrote:
What did you do?
1. Choose the day. Overcast, 100% cloud, very diffuse light, no shadows - but bright.What did you do?
2. Choose the lens. From past experience I knew that the FA77 with a short tube could do this sort of thing. For the ultimate in sharpness I'd have used a macro lens.
3. Choose a fairly wide aperture (f3.2 as it happens, I thought it was f2.8!). Guaranteed very shallow DOF so almost everything in the picture would necessarily be soft.
4. Choose the light. Foliage surrounding a flower or bud would give a green cast to the light, which seems to help with giving a feeling of softness. (I first discovered the effect of reflected green light when the underside of a low flying skylark appeared strangely green in a photo. Never forgot that one!)
5. Hand held, manual focus (no AF with a tube so no option :wink, body (mine, not the camera) in strange positions (). Almost guaranteed to ensure nothing would be razor sharp. For ultimate sharpness the tripod would have been used.
6. Evolve towards the right picture. These weren't the first buds and flowers photographed in that session. It started with a red fuchsia but that didn't seem to work so went to pink and worked through several flowers and buds until light, background, surrounding foliage etc. looked right. Then I tried some more and didn't find any better.
7. Use what's there to advantage. The green haze over most of the lower part of the first photo is from a leaf that was very close to the lens and protruding part-way across it. Moving it out of the way did cross my mind (I prefer not to remove bits of plants unless absolutely essential) but the view through the viewfinder suggested otherwise. So really just a bit of luck that a leaf turned up in the unexpectedly right place - sometimes luck is on your side .
8. Don't show the shots that didn't work...
Spad wrote:
AI Denoise and Sharpening are not demons. It depends how hard you hit them.
100% agree . They are tools to be used with discretion and when they are the best tools for the job. And they are not intelligent (in spite of the hype) - the real intelligence is (or at least should be) in the person who is using them.AI Denoise and Sharpening are not demons. It depends how hard you hit them.
Steve
Posted 02/10/2023 - 11:38
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Thanks for the response, Lubbyman, incredibly informative. Also agree with your response to Spad. Looking at the images again - so good, great results.
Be well, stay safe, but most of all, invest in memories
Posted 02/10/2023 - 20:48
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Working out logically what had been done almost intuitively was actually an interesting exercise. Note to self: Do it more often!
And I must give credit where it's due for the idea of putting a short tube on an FA77mm ltd lens or similar - it came from LennyBloke (as did the lens and tubes, too :wink.
Steve
And I must give credit where it's due for the idea of putting a short tube on an FA77mm ltd lens or similar - it came from LennyBloke (as did the lens and tubes, too :wink.
Steve
Posted 08/10/2023 - 13:11
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AI is a dangerous path...
Could I chuck one these thru Topaz DeNoise and see what happens?
Could I chuck one these thru Topaz DeNoise and see what happens?
Posted 08/10/2023 - 13:38
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Yeah, have a go with both, see what happens. Whatever it does, it won't be what I wanted when I was contorting myself to get the shots - unless it decides they are beyond hope and gives up!
Steve
Steve
Posted 08/10/2023 - 18:40
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Here's the results....
DeNoise
Sharpen
DeNoise
Sharpen
Posted 08/10/2023 - 18:58
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Interesting to see - but in this case neither match the softer beauty of the original (IMO) - but there are of course many examples where AI sharpening is a real improvement
LennyBloke
Posted 08/10/2023 - 19:47
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Oh... i haven't processed. I just ran them thru Topaz and let it decide the best route.
Posted 08/10/2023 - 21:42
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LennyBloke wrote:
Interesting to see
Yes, 'interesting' was my reaction, too. Among other things, it has done what I chose not to do - sharpen edges that could be sharpened. I made a deliberate decision in order to achieve a creative (I hesitate to use the word 'artistic'...) aim. Not having a mind of its own, the computer programme did what it was developed to do - denoise and sharpen. It might do it very well, perhaps better than more traditional methods. But IMHO using the word 'intelligence' in this sort of context is just marketing hype hijacked from technical terminology.Interesting to see
Steve
Posted 09/10/2023 - 01:59
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Lubbyman wrote:
But IMHO using the word 'intelligence' in this sort of context is just marketing hype hijacked from technical terminology.
I could not agree more... But IMHO using the word 'intelligence' in this sort of context is just marketing hype hijacked from technical terminology.
It's a good bit of kit but the AI part is just a fashionable phrase that is exploited!
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3019 posts
18 years
South Dorset
K3 + FA77mm + 20mm tube.
Thoughts, comments etc. welcome as usual.
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Steve