Value for insurance

Hey,

In separate thread I mentioned that I got my lens damaged and had insured it by using eBay valuation as the lens is out of production (F 50mm f1.7 £100).

This got me thinking, how do people insure their gear?

Most insurances are New for Old, thus should use prices from official retailers, but what about gear that is not available as "New" anymore?

For example, I have a K 50mm f1.2, currently insured at it's market value of £250; it has no equivalents in production, nor there have been since 2000.
Hence, if going by "New for Old", what should have I used? DA* 55mm? FA 50mm? Or perhaps A 50 f1.2 as it is technically newer?!

Same applies to my Original Pentax bellows, the only bellows Pentax currently produces are the "Photo Duplicator" at £799 .
Which is silly money compared to my £120 bellows set.

Under house insurance it might make little to no difference, but under Photography gear insurance these add considerably to the premium.

Or how should I insure my K5, which is discontinued, but still available in some random online stores.
At £200-£300 (eBay replacement price), K5-II or K3 price?

What are your thoughts and how do you price your discontinued gear?
Also if insuring £120 bellows for £799 Photo duplicator, wouldn't the insurance decline the claim?

PS: I know the insurance doesn't care if FA 31 or DA* 300 is insured for the £800, they insure the amount of money. But the question is aimed at, what is fair? And also making the most of "New for Old"

I would ask a supplier for a new for old valuation letter, where they would list the items lost and their new equivalents. The new equivalents are the price you should be insured for. They may well charge you for such a valuation.

Some years ago we had a break-in and quite a bit of photo gear was taken with out of production items stolen. My home insurance covered it with a new for old. They basically paid me the money to buy the stuff myself. I gave them valuations where I could of what a new equivalent would be (so eg my Z1-P film camera was stolen. In its day top of the line model. At the time the K20D was top of the line, so they paid for that). I basically gave them Jessops web-site prices with a link to it.

We also had an old Chinon film SLR that was stolen, and Chinon no longer made and put down the K200D for that (even though it had been a top of the line model as well in its day - I didn't feel right about putting that down as another K20D!). Initially I tried to reason with the insurance company about it, to discuss what would be fair (ie, say £100 for such an item), but they didn't seem to be able to cope with that and just wanted to know about new for old a that is what the policy was.

For those items that were irreplaceable - as John says let a supplier help with suggestions so it comes out fair.

I add all of my major camera kit, Bodies, lenses & flashguns into an Excel spreadsheet, noting things like model no, serial No, purchase cost, replacement cost & date.
We recently had to use our Household insurance (Aviva) as my better half dropped the camera bag off the tailgate of my pickup, damaging 3 lenses.....
Two of the lenses were repairable but the 3rd was 'BER' and so it was replaced.
All of this was performed with an absolute minimum of fuss by Aviva...cannot recommend them highly enough...
values for current lenses from SRS/Amazon websites

Andy

[quote:3496ace15f="johnriley"]I would ask a supplier for a new for old valuation letter, where they would list the items lost and their new equivalents. The new equivalents are the price you should be insured for. They may well charge you for such a valuation.[/quote

What john said is correct but the insurance company's still don't take no notice of that they are so blinkered they just do what they like as been there done that and got a headache for my troubles
Regards stu

Sometimes we need to be firm with insurers and know our rights. There are industry guidlines/rules for them and they know what they are.

CAB is a good place to get advice if you're uncertain or having problems with your insurer. And change your insurer for next time of course if you're not happy.

Sometimes you just need to talk to them.
I had a break in some time back and they smashed my beautiful Sony direct drive turntable. The insurers tried to palm me off, or so it seemed to me at the time, with the current top Sony turntable, a much cheaper belt drive job. I complained and they asked what would be an equivalent, they had no idea really. I found a price for a suitable replacement and they paid me the cash!
I did replace it with the belt drive turntable but it was the more expensive model they had insured and I had lost.

I realized they were not trying it on, they just didn't understand the value of the item lost and were quite happy to pay when it was made clear.

You are entitled to the value of the item lost but if the item is no longer available then a suitable replacement is fine. If it is a new for old policy then you should get the nearest equivalent not settle for a lower value item. Don't try it on though, asking for a K3 when you lost an Optio is dishonest and likely to get you in trouble.

Lots of interesting stories there.

The consensus seems to be that:

If there is a current equivalent available then insure it for that price.
If not, then get a professional price estimate.

That means I have managed to incorrectly insure almost all my gear. I was pricing them at eBay prices, for equivalent gear.
I guess I will call up mine, and see what will they say about my underpriced lens.

I wonder, if anyone who had an LX in 2000, got a modern equivalent of LX 2000?!