The challenge for Pentax

They now have a class leading product range but to a degree face the same problem as Olympus (who also in my view have class leading and excellent products) and the difficult part is getting the public to know how good they are and think of buying them in preference to what they see all the pro's shooting (Canon and Nikon) at Wimbledon etc.

The next step I think is to get some pro's on side, have trade stands at the shows and build true dealer loyalty. I have found for example at London camera Exchange that the sales people are familiar with the Canon and Nikon menu system whereas I had a salesman say he didn't know why I wanted a Pentax because their menu system was so complicated (it isn't, it's just his lack of familiarity with it made him think it was less intuitive than Canikon). He told me they hardly sold any pentax but given he didn't know the features, the Pentax differentiators or his way around the menus and had the only body they had tucked away at the back of the shop it's small wonder they don't sell many!!

The fact Pentax are now in John Lewis is something if I were Ricoh Imaging I would really be working with. John lewis would I'm sure be delighted if the Ricoh people arranged familiarity/benefits training for their staff either on site or at pentax Ricoh HQ. I really think Ricoh need to clarify the process needed to get their dealers on side. I truly believe that a Pentax K3 has many advantages over a Nikon D7100 or Canon EOS 7D but they need to get the salesmen and women to believe it too!! I actually think the K3 is an absolute bargain and if anything it's in the lower APSC level where Pentax don't have the same competitive edge against say Nikon. My Sister was interested in a very cheap bottom end DSLR and when I looked the Nikon D3200 was 24Mp and cheaper than the Pentax K500/K50 at 16MP with a kit lens. Pentax also don't say anything much about their heritage and achievements when in reality they have a better history of innovation and development than Canikon. There seem to be a lot of people who don't realise that until 1995 ish Pentax were one of the 'big 5' camera makers and probably just as commonplace as Canon and Nikon. A lot has changed in 20 years and it's time to reverse the decline.

Just thinking out of the box for example why don't they have an interview/tribute with David Bailey about the fact he used a Pentax on the most important fashion shoot in history in New York with Jean Shrimpton? They could film it in house on Pentax gear, put it on their website or pitch it to TV companies as a series of TV shows about great photographers, I bet you could find a whole bunch of other pros who wouldn't mind one bit doing a 30 minute interview/documentary about their life and work and association with pentax. You could pick interesting peple like Leonard Nimoy (does he use Pentax?) or that supermodel turned photographer who used to use a Pentax 6x7 or even Patrick Demarchelier, Peter Lindberg, Steven Meisel, Helmut Newton and Arthur Elgort who all used the 67 Pentax. Then there's paul McCartney and Ringo who all seemd to have Pentaxes with them on their first USA trip. If they can get Kanarek back I'm sure he'd be up for it too! You could do it as a sort of part photography history/documentary about the history of photography and then how a different famous photographer fits into that history.

I think it would be worth millions in TV exposure and could be done at relatively low cost...

Jonathan

Some interesting points there Jonathan. I'm not sure David bailey is the answer, as there are not that many people these days perhaps who would think his endorsement from the 1960s was really relevant to them today. The first time he was asked "What do you use now?" the campaign might unravel a bit.

Pentax seem to be making more effort in totally new areas - outdoor magazines, bright colours weather resistance, adventure proof compacts - all the stuff for rough outdoor photography. There's a lot of Pentax promotion going on, much of it in areas I don't and perhaps most of us here don't look at routinely.

I suspect the pure photographer of the traditional kind is becoming a smaller and smaller market segment.

Without getting into a yours is bigger type match, there are some basic spec items that Pentax will need to address sooner or later also. Autofocus ability and number of sensor points is a prime example.

Many new buyers look for some measure to assess products against each other, hence the mega pixel race, and regardless of their use or importance, you need to bring these as prerequisites to the party.

Video is another one, with Pentax having offered this for 5 years now. Every review they get knocked back on this front, and it would be rather simple to improve this. The 645z is an example of this, epic camera but rubbished too often because of their marketing attempt to claim it as the first mf camera with video.

Agree about the product placement in real stores for example. Hard to sell one that isn't in front of the buyer, despite buyers generally being more informed than ever nowadays.

In the Seventies working for Campkins we had product from every make equally on display. There was Nikon, Canon, Olympus, Pentax, Konica, Leica, Practica,Minolta, Rollei,Minox,Ricoh,Yashica, Agfa, Kodak, Polaroid and more I can't recall all filling our cabinets.

Top end enthusiasts were knowledgable from the magazines and their clubs but the rest did rely on our expertise (which we took trade exams for). Firms like Leica sent reps around to plug their wares but at branch level we were mostly only pressured to get as much money through the till as possible, much of it was of course developing and printing form our own labs. David Bailey's OM adverts did have an impact but most punters couldn't afford them so bought a Trip, our best seller

I visited John Lewis with my son at Christmas. They didn't have a clue about anything they were selling!

Ricoh have a hard task to expand their brand awareness and to get Pro's on board in numbers. The full frame if any good will make an impression as the 645z has. Perhaps this will trickle down as other makes?

It's nothing to do with what the' pros' are using, the average 'new to DSLR' user (who couldn't care less what the pros use) goes into any 'camera shop' asks about a digital slr and is immediately given a choice of canon or nikon ("Because that's what we're told to sell" I was once informed . Most of them are given a sales pitch by a 'sales person' who often knows very little about the product and has to consult the internet for info to show the customer (it happened to me in jessops when I asked to see the Pentax Q).
I once asked in 'London Camera Exchange' why they had very few Pentaxes and the reply was: "All our shelf space is 'bought up' (in other words - rented) by nikon and canon and we don't have room for anything else", it seems only nikon and canon (and presumably sony too now) could afford the high cost of renting shelf space in these shops so if the product is not displayed how are 'newbies' going to be aware of Pentax and the like?

When people see my K5 they say "Oh it's Pentax, they're good cameras aren't they? or something similar,
it seems to me that the highest bidder gets the most exposure in shops....nothing to do with the quality of product.
How many people looking for paint for decorating ask for Dulux when there are many other 'smaller' brands equally as good and often better and cheaper?......MARKETING -----SIMPLE, It's not rocket science

+1 to the above

They have to get the product in the major retailers. They have to demonstrate that images taken with Pentaxes can be excellent. They have to get the message across.

I recently intervened in a thread on a forum I can't name. A potential purchaser asked the proverbial question Canon or Nikon (that question sadly is asked all the time) and had been researching which was the better high end APSC camera to buy for several months. I suggested looking also at a Pentax, showed some of my images taken with a Pentax. Result? K3 purchased a couple of days later.

They are pushing on social media but the images really are frankly often ordinary and sometimes poor. They have given up on the PPG - why? It was a brilliant idea to showcase the best Pentax images and a great source for Pentax to discover images which they could use to promote their gear.

I think the problem is that the marketing department is staffed with just marketing people. They need photographers in there.

I was recently approached by Ricoh to use one of my images for marketing purposes. They weren't prepared to pay me anything, so they didn't get the image. If they are only going to use images they get for free for advertising the capabilities of their equipment, it's hardly surprising that the images we see from them on social media are often not very good. If they want their cameras to be seen as professional products, they should not be relying on the generosity/naivety of amateurs to promote their products.

On a similar note, the terms and conditions of their MyPentax gallery don't encourage anyone to upload their best shots:

"The user agrees to transfer to RICOH IMAGING EUROPE and any company of the RICOH group the reproduction and exploitation rights for the content that it publishes online, worldwide and for the duration of the copyright protection, including in particular the right to publish this photograph in full or in part on any of the websites of RICOH IMAGING EUROPE and the websites of the RICOH group. He/she warrants to RICOH IMAGING EUROPE that he/she holds all intellectual property rights to this photograph and that this photograph does not infringe on any rights of a third party.

For technical reasons, the user acknowledges that his/her name or pseudonym shall not appear or is not likely to appear on the photograph."

I deleted my pics from MyPentax gallery after i found out the terms. I'm an amateur and do not expect payment. i do expect to be asked permission and credited properly though. 'Technical reasons' does not wash does it?

How's the response to our being asked to ask questions coming on then?

How's the Pentax representative on here doing? There was one briefly.

I think I'll give up forums and just go enjoy my camera. They don't deserve our loyalty.

I 'liked' Ricoh UK on facebook as part of some promotion a while back. I must say that I agree with the statement above. There are some nice photos shown, but there are some shockers that PR should have screened through. By contrast the Canon facebook page I also liked for similar reasons a while back showcases some stunning photographs regularly, and I know clearly which one conveys the better message.

Taking the last point Bill, this forum has no connection with Ricoh as such - it's produced by Magezine Publishing. The genesis of why and how it's here stems from the Pentax User Club. although many will have forgotten or never known how it came about. So loyalty to Pentax/Ricoh or forums are two entirely different things.

Yes, there was a Pentax person on here briefly, who didn't get a particularly warm welcome from some I'm afraid, but that has nothing to do with the current ownership situation and happened in a different, unconnected era of Pentax's history.

The questions remain unanswered, but Nik has done what she can I'm sure to expedite the response.

The PPG is also unconnected to Pentax User. I stopped posting, ironically for technical reasons, because it was too much of a bind to resize yet another set of images just for PPG. I didn't have time.

Hope that all helps!

I'm sure you are right John but the old Pentax had a direct link to this site which encouraged me to subscribe to what seemed an exclusive Pentax Magazine just before it folded. I always assumed it was produced at the behest of the manufacturer as a brand magazine.

Quote...

Taking the last point Bill, this forum has no connection with Ricoh as such - it's produced by Magezine Publishing.

No, it certainly doesn't, it just alienates amateurs as well as professionals. In fact, that statement is somewhat contradicted by their offer of giving me a credit as sole payment for use of my image.

If they want to succeed I think they need to address their PR.

It's not been a magazine owned by Pentax ever Bill. I can't tell you the ins and outs of contracts, but as I understand it probably approval was given to do it, but the publishers have always been independent. Cox Associates had it for a long time and used it to promote their guided photo trips and then Peter Bargh took it and improved it immensely in my opinion.

So it's not been produced at the behest of Pentax and what's been in it has been independent. Pentax used to include info on Pentax User in the camera boxes supplied in the UK, but then stopped doing it at some point.