Shooting Birds.... The feathered kind!

That why use a large depth of field! That way you can know your field of focus and hand hold the flash and move it about to get different lighting effects!

Or even allowed, but actually of course you can, but in context and not so it overwhelmes the forum with alternative marque talk. Common sense...

Bats fly in darkness, so it's highly unlikely indeed that any AF system would find the creature. If it did then it wouldn't be able to focus in the dimness and the shutter speed would be ludicrous for a flying object.

Prefocusing on a spot and using some sort of IR trigger to fire the flash would seem a likely method. When the bat crosses the trigger beam, the flash fires, or something along those lines perhaps.

Dan,

I know its not a bat, Red Kite, Harrier Hawk or some other fast bird, however, I think the European Roller I caught was pretty fast.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3543/3526331502_a4031c898c.jpg?v=0

And just to prove it I have put the original on as well

link

We spent a long time with these birds, I was with Nikon and Canon users with better cameras than me. I was shooting AF on continous shoot, trying to track the birds as they were flying, looking away from the viewfinder to see where they were. I can remember getting very frustrated and saying I was giving up and didn't know how I had managed to get draged into such a pointless exercise. I only found this one when I got home.

So if I can get a shot like this some of the more experienced members should be able to do a lot better.

I am not having a go at you, just trying to show what is possible if you try

Jeanette, I think you may have got the wrong end of the stick regarding my post. All I was saying is that because a bat is tiny, and flies very fast in the dark, no camera is going to be able to reliably lock on to one using autofocus.

Just about all the decent shots of flying bats that you will see are, like John suggested, taken using infra-red triggers and flash.

And with wild birds it's patience and knowledge that will ultimately get the best shot. And a hide comes in useful too. For instance, with your Roller, for the best photo you would have had to spend time observing their habits, gradually move into position, preferably in a hide, and then you might have got a close up shot, with the best chance of success. And by 'time' I mean days (or weeks), rather than hours.

It doesn't matter how technically capable a photographer is, if they're trying to get decent bird photos from 50 feet away, they're almost certainly going to be disappointed.

It's why I rarely take bird photos - I just haven't got the patience to put the time in to get decent shots. A friend of mine is happy to spend 9 hours a day in his private, bespoke hide waiting for 'his' Kingfishers to turn up. He's got some amazing photos as a result, but that sort of photography is not for me.

Dan

tut tut, picky picky now john, no your right my text slang is terrible, i should cut it out,

So my best chance is prefocusing and hoping I get lucky, flash,tripod and remote release too I reckon
Afraid I don't possess an IR trigger, but will look into that, always happy to experiment.

Didn't really think that I could get AF locked on, but wasn't sure with the massive increase in technology.

Going to give it a go, thankfully they come out before its really dark and lately have been as predictable as a bat will ever be in their flightpath

They seem to fly in pairs or threes, so that might help a bit.
Would add that from my experience watching them they are in no way similar to a bird in flight

Thanks for the advice and sorry if I inadvertently stirred up the which brand chat again

Cheers
Rich

Dan,

Sorry if I seemed upset or annoyed. I was just trying to get people thinking it might be possible. I really feel that the results from Pentax cameras are not appreciated as much as other makes and I see it as my personal mission to prompt their strengths whenever I can. I do try to ensure I am with non Pentax users normally though
I appreciate wildlife photography is not for everyone. I really enjoy it out in Africa - not sure I could stay in a hide for 9 hours waiting for a Kingfisher either Maybe you are right and the bat is just too small and fast. I know one thing for sure - it won't be me that shows it can be done - at the moment I can't even manage an in focus shot of a non flying bird

J

Dependent on the species: pheasant, partridge, grouse, woodcock, duck goose &c &c.

Look at the speed the bird is flying at and whether coming towards, crossing, going away &c and calculate the lead.

Then using the right size shot from #3 up to #8 and about 28 gram of it discharge one barrel immediately followed by the second!

Then send your dog to retrieve the quarry!

(Gives Polchraine extra hard Paddington stony stare)

Back on topic sort of I am going the other way. I want to take aircraft pictures but there are a limited number of airshows I can get to so I have been practising on seagulls. I would assume the tactic is similar. I have been using my 60-255, 300 and 150-500 using relatively high shutter speed and panning.

[IMG]http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc222/Oggy3323/IMGP1121-1.jpg[/IMG]

300mm at 1/800th

[IMG]http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc222/Oggy3323/IMGP1159.jpg[/IMG]

300mm at 1/2000th

I thought they where but I am struggling to get a good shot of a bird in flight!

Aircraft have a predictable flight path and they are also a lot further away so the panning is not as erratic or as fast, so that makes them easier to shoot. Like I said in a few earlier posts I usually don't go over 1/500 shutter speed when shooting fast jets. I also use a set point where the camera is focused on.

I am off to Wales in a few weeks and I will be getting into the hills with my new lens so hopefully will have some good shots!

I think my problem shooting birds is being to slow on the shutter speed. I am finding shooting birds requires faster panning because they are closer so maybe cracking upto 1/1000 shutter speed may yield better results! I am gonna go for a play in a bit and I will let you know!

Oggy

You have probably guessed but I also engage in game shooting and everything that is shot is eaten - with the exception of vermin.

However, managing to hit a pheasant an 40, 50 or 60 metres is not easy and has to take into account a lot more factors than using a camera on the same target. When photographing birds in flight - not very often though, I use the same principles and am reasonably successful.

Think where it is going, what speed it is travelling at and work with the bird's motion to trap it at the right spot.

Of all the game birds - I would challenge anyone to get a good picture of a woodcock in flight from 40 metres.

I'm with Dan on this. Sitting and watching birds for some time helps you understand their likely actions. You get to see the tell-tale signs that they're about to take off. Make sure the lens is pre-focused to their static position and be ready to follow their flight. Practice without taking photos but just following the birds in flight through the VF. As Dan says, bird of most often quite predictable and you can anticipate where they're going to be.

I use both AF-C and AF-S depending on how confident I feel (and even Manual focusing with some success). You do really need good light so that the camera focus can keep up (click the image for better IQ as the forum degrades it with downsizing):

Lapwing in flight on Flickr - Photo Sharing!



Lapwing in flight on Flickr - Photo Sharing!



Cavorting Crows on Flickr - Photo Sharing!



Swan in Flight on Flickr - Photo Sharing!



Grey Heron on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Im using a k20d and a 150-500mm and I do find the slow shutter speed can be an issue sometimes, especially with action shots. There are a few 'cheats' I have worked out to get birds in flight now I finally have a camera with fast enough focus and little shutter lag now!

Large birds fly slower and are easier

On beaches etc where the wind blows in one direction gulls etc often hover of gently flap but dont really change postion

Catch birds as they take off

Dont use full zoom when panning

Continous autofocus isnt always the best, but often is


Sorry if this obvious to most of you, but I figured it might come in handy for someone new to this kind of set up too