Processors

Sorry Russ, I didn't mean to imply that life only started with the K7 (well only mine anyway! ) - but what I meant was it introduced the new body style and physical controls that are still current on the K5II - the K3 is the first change in flagship body since 2009.

Thanks for all the comments. Can I give one small example of my reasoning regarding my decision, and PLEASE, this is purely a personal reason not to be taken as a general perspective. Re - shooting modes; I can see why they are provided and I also realise that they needn't be used, but, for me, I want to learn how to use the camera and to end up with images which I know I am responsible for, good or bad. Yes I know that I could use modes as a learning tool (checking what settings the mode had chosen for a particular scene and then applying those settings at a later date), but I would prefer to reach my desired result through my own efforts. In that context I (personally) would find the Modes too much of a temptation and don't feel that I would get the same satisfaction as I would through trial and error. So I suppose I'm forcing myself to learn, albeit perhaps the hard way. Finally,(although it's unlikely) were I ever to find myself in the position of wishing to buy an even more professional camera, I would be pre-armed with the knowledge that using scene modes had denied me. Maybe I'm too easily led into temptation, but that's just me...

Hi all,

Yeah I must reaffirm that I'm not suggesting the K-30 is the superior camera, more that I was saying the K-30 technically has the components to give higher specification models a pretty good run for their money.

Whilst the camera is a big part of the photo, the lenses do the light capture and shaping, which is then presented to any camera body to do the capture. I guess where I was going with this, is that for your money a K-30/50 and a nice lens may be a better starting bet than a more expensive body alone.

In most cases the K-30 does have all the same options as the more expensive models, it just loses physical switches for them is all. On the K-30 you lose the AF mode switch (with regards to focus points) which I hardly ever use given I shoot single centre focus mode or manual focus at all times. You also don't get a separate exposure mode button, which would be nice, but for the amount of times I use it I don't mind quick menu diving. For me this usually sits at centre weighted most of the time, so is hardly ever changed, or is set just the once at the start of a session.

This is all personal taste obviously, but for me I'm now only down to a difference between a 1/6000 vs 1/8000 maximum shutter speed option, which I've never really encountered a need for yet.

I guess I'm lucky in that Pentax offered an option where it's assumptions and points to cut back on were closely aligned to what I could put up with. There is no option for a battery grip, but spare batteries are cheap and it takes AA types. It's not a magnesium frame, but past a certain point it doesn't matter how the frame holds up in the internals are shaken free, or dials fly off or lenses push the mount back into the camera etc. There is no audio input option for video or headphone output. So I admit it's not all good clearly.

I had to laugh at myself here because I had to quickly go an check if the K-30 actually has shooting modes and it does. Clearly I've never used them but I guess it's nice to have potentially, maybe if I'm passing the camera to someone else to use for a while etc?

Anyhow, congrats on your purchase, whichever way you go. We look forward to seeing some of your photos.

Somethings are more important than 'extensive custom settings' - e.g how good is the sensor? Also one of the things I have always loved about Pentax is compactness - I'm not interested in sticking a lumpy grip to my beautiful K30!

Ps I agree with Richard 100%

Well someone at Pentax designing cameras presumably thinks extras such as more custom settings and grips are important to some ... Lucky we have the choice and you were able to choose a K30. Truth is I wouldn't be using Pentax if we didn't have the K7 or K5, I'd have chosen an offering from another brand that offered important photographic physical controls and extensive function options plus battery grip ... I doubt I'd be so satisfied with the package though, and its value.

Just reading this thread for the first time, the questions being asked and responded to are ones often raised.

From my perspective, the choice would have to be a K-5II or K-5IIs. The Mk1 whilst it has a superb sensor simply has too many compromises in the AF department, whereas the K-5II and K-5IIs are bullet proof in this regard for everything except focus tracking.

The K-5's also have superb build, great weather sealing, all metal construction and many other nice features that I would not be prepared to compromise on. A K-3 would be even better, but the K-5's have image quality that is virtually on a par with the K-3, and better if you do a lot of high dynamic range shooting or high ISO shooting.

Regards
David

Good points David, the IQ and build aspects are always key. What are some of those other features that you would not want to compromise on? I was sold on my Pentax K7 in a shop where I could hardly make proper sensor comparisons ... It was what I could see,feel and take control of on the camera itself that elevated it above the competition.

For me it's very much about ergonomics, I have an old GX20 while my wife has a KR. I would say that the KR has a far better sensor and is capable of doing everything the GX20 does but better. However it just doesn't feel right to me. Like many cameras from other manufactuers whom I wont mention, it feels like a toy. It feels to plasticky, it lacks substance and the controls just aint where i want them to be.

I don't want to have to scroll through a long list of menus to get the settings I want, then find that by the time I get to settings that I want the moment is gone. Lord have mercy I couldn't live without that LCD screen on top of my GX20. I just wish they still made cameras with brass top and bottom plates, I liked the weight of them old SLR's and ahh the look of brass just starting to peep through the paint after years of relentless picture taking. For me the cameras got to feel right in your hands and become an extension of you, no matter what the make or model.

Have you tried any of the other Pentax models Nigel? Have you tried the K30 for example? To not consider the other members of the range is a mistake - how can you dismiss them if you have not tried them? Personally I'd be very happy to have a very basic camera with aperture, shutter speed control and a shutter button and that's it - but it would have to have a first class sensor - and to be honest that's what the K30 gives me - but it does have much much more to offer. It's build is first class and it feels good in the hand too, brilliant focus plus focus peaking, it feels solid especially with a weighty lens attached - other wise I would not have brought it. I say don't dismiss other choices unless you can talk from experience and just becuse you might not fancy that model does not mean it would not suit someone else. It's quite a few years ago now but at a local newspaper we used to use Nikkormats - not Nikon F's etc and they were great - you don't always need the 'flag ship' camera to get great results.

Processing engines apart, with all its limitations I cant help feeling that a 645Zs would fit just nicely in my hands.

I have in fact tried a K30, a few times in a Currys shop - of course thats not the same as using it properly, but enough to get a feel and sense of the ergonomics and features. But I'm not trying to dismiss the other Pentax models - not at all - in fact my advice to Snoops when he originally asked about the cameras was to recommend he bought a NEW K50! But he sees the extra features & physical controls as important, something to 'grow into' apparently, and I can understand that decision.

What I meant earlier is that it was not the K7's sensor that sold me the camera (and the Pentax brand) in the shop ... (how can anyone really compare sensor IQs in a shop?) ... but the rest of the package - construction, feel, usability features, physical controls, and the clearly sophisticated and extensive customisation options - the truth is I doubt that I would have been much interested if I'd been trying the K30 then, it doesn't have those same features that stood heads above the competition .... I actually didn't care that much about the sensor! There's much more of importance to a good camera than its sensor.

I like my K30 a lot.

We all have different priorities, and we are lucky that we have a choice with our cameras. Whats best for one photographer is not necessarily best for another. Whats interesting about the K30 is that a lot of owners of the model don't use the scene modes on it - Pentax has put them there as they target the intended market, but the camera is being used by a different target market. What does that say about the K30?

Of all the features in the camera, how many users actually shoot video. So far I've never had a need for the video and not used it yet "just to see".

There's still a duality in the user base for high quality DSLR video ... the people who bought good DSLRs traditionally were (and mostly still are) photographers. Those who wanted high quality video bought HD camcorders.

Not many would have had had both I'm guessing, so in a way HD video on a DSLR is the ideal combination. But the users have to have it in their blood! I've embraced it as a new opportunity as I never used a quality video camera. But it involves adapting technique to the medium and using the camera in a different, dedicated video kind of way.

The DSLR advantage is the better creative options available with the huge range of lenses available for DSLR systems - much more than traditional video cameras and at more realistic prices. So its an opportunity waiting to be seized really! But until the user bases align (ie the same people wanting DSLR type photography plus high quality HD video) then its unlikely that the options will be further explored.