pixel-shifting

alfpics
Posted 24/03/2015 - 21:47 Link
A very interesting article from Imaging Resource on this from Ricoh/ Pentax - along with some other interesting things like lens coatings and other 'clarity' functions etc
link
Andy
Edited by alfpics: 24/03/2015 - 21:47
bjolester
Posted 24/03/2015 - 23:00 Link
Thank you for sharing this interesting article! Having owned and used a Sigma DP2 Merrill for about half a year, I must say it sounds very promising that Ricoh Pentax are researching into a "foveon-like" sensor technology. If they manage to produce a sensor that records pure RGB instead of the more common Bayer "guess-work", and implement it into the new FF, it would be quite sensational. Only Sigma Foveon have been able to come up with a sensor that really records colours in full RGB, but their cameras are very cumbersome and quirky, and the Sigma foveon software is terrible. I really hope Pentax can surprise us with something very special with their new FF. Some people hope for a 50mp sensor in this FF Pentax, I hope for a revolutionary new sensor technology: Foveon/Full RGB in a Pentax package.
Bjørn

PPG
Flickr
Edited by bjolester: 24/03/2015 - 23:00
richandfleur
Posted 24/03/2015 - 23:38 Link
Interesting that they make a point of Ricoh looking after their customers with regards to pixel shift tech. Will be interesting to see if that translates into a firmware update.
kh1234567890
Posted 24/03/2015 - 23:59 Link
Not the pixel shifting dream again ...
bjolester
Posted 25/03/2015 - 06:21 Link
kh1234567890 wrote:
Not the pixel shifting dream again ...
Are you able to formulate a short summary of the most important points in the patent document
Bjørn

PPG
Flickr
kh1234567890
Posted 25/03/2015 - 09:25 Link
bjolester wrote:
kh1234567890 wrote:
Not the pixel shifting dream again ...
Are you able to formulate a short summary of the most important points in the patent document
Certainly :

It proposes two separate systems for moving the sensor, one electromagnetic for shake compensation and the other piezoelectric for fast fine pixel-scale adjustment. Plus a lot of patentese repetition and distraction.
MattMatic
Posted 25/03/2015 - 09:32 Link
Actually, that's an interesting patent... shows that Olympus must've licensed the patent for their cameras using exactly that technology.

As a side point, I'm coming to the conclusion that the MX-1 is largely Olympus - the tilt screen mechanism is identical, and the optics appear the same. It may explain why there's been no firmware update for the MX-1.

It would be nice if that back-ported any new technology into the K3, K5ii/s etc
Matt
http://www.mattmatic.co.uk
(For gallery, tips and links)
bjolester
Posted 25/03/2015 - 10:10 Link
kh1234567890 wrote:
bjolester wrote:
kh1234567890 wrote:
Not the pixel shifting dream again ...
Are you able to formulate a short summary of the most important points in the patent document
Certainly :

It proposes two separate systems for moving the sensor, one electromagnetic for shake compensation and the other piezoelectric for fast fine pixel-scale adjustment. Plus a lot of patentese repetition and distraction.
Thank you! I became seriously overwhelmed when I opened the patent document, and gave up. But reading your short summary makes me feel quite excited about future Pentax cameras. The future looks bright for Pentax
Bjørn

PPG
Flickr
SteveLedger
Posted 25/03/2015 - 20:57 Link
MattMatic wrote:

As a side point, I'm coming to the conclusion that the MX-1 is largely Olympus - the tilt screen mechanism is identical, and the optics appear the same.
Or the other way around
Either way, I believe Asia Optical had a lot to do with the two cameras including the also similar Casio Exilim EX-10.
johnriley
Posted 25/03/2015 - 22:46 Link
Probably the source company for some components (lens perhaps) is the same. In any event, it's a good design.
Best regards, John
SteveLedger
Posted 25/03/2015 - 23:06 Link
Although we love our PENTAX cameras, and I'm sure a lot of PENTAX DNA goes into the final product, we can't ever be sure we're getting 100% Pentax designed/built products.
Aside from optical components, Asia Optical produce many digital cameras, they manufactured KODAK cameras in the past and now do so again for JK Imaging who resurrected the KODAK brand. Who knows how many other brands.
Some of AO's unlabeled re-shellable fully customisable cameras even have IBIS.
I'd like to think my PENTAX cameras are conceived, designed, engineered and built 'in-house' but modern day manufacturing alliances mean we'll never be sure about this.
Doesn't stop me buying PENTAX products though
richandfleur
Posted 25/03/2015 - 23:17 Link
Yeah Kodak sell the Pentax action camera in another case, or that should probably be the other way around actually.

The Pixel shift high res concept is interesting, but only if it can give some improvement in the image quality. Simply creating a larger picture alone doesn't guarantee this. ie if you're not going to print big or heavily crop then I don't see the point. That seemed to be the feedback from Pentax, who said they had done it, but it didn't really do anything to the picture except for make it bigger.
SteveLedger
Posted 26/03/2015 - 00:00 Link
Yeh I forgot about the similarity between the Ricoh WG-M1 and the Pixpro SP1
50mpCMOS
Posted 26/03/2015 - 14:01 Link
Quote:
used a Sigma DP2 Merrill for about half a year, I must say it sounds very promising that Ricoh Pentax are researching into a "foveon-like" sensor technology. If they manage to produce a sensor that records pure RGB instead of the more common Bayer "guess-work", and implement it into the new FF, it would be quite sensational. Only Sigma Foveon have been able to come up with a sensor that really records colours in full RGB, but their cameras are very cumbersome and quirky, and the Sigma foveon software is terrible.
I've also used two separate Sigma camera bodies with that type of sensor. Depending upon the subject, lighting, and all... I've found that the Sigma SD1, and even the built in lens Sigmas are able to capture better than any of the Pentax 16mp sensors. The Sigmas even come close to the b&w quality of a Leica Monochrom - ouch.

But you are quite correct, the software is some of the worst out on the market.
johnriley
Posted 26/03/2015 - 14:54 Link
Sigma cameras are outside the remit of Pentax User, but for the record I have reviewed their fixed lens cameras and was not impressed, but there we are.

The 16MP sensor Pentax cameras are actually quite hard to beat in many ways.
Best regards, John

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