K10D sharpness still raging (will it ever be put to bed)

The bottom line is really, if you have taken an 'in focus' image with a K10D and a sharp lens, you can produce sharp results during post-processing. The difference between Pentax kit and 'the rest' is that this sharpening is not automatically over-stated with the in-camera processing.

I think that most of us agree here that sharpening is best left to individual taste, and not the camera manufacturer. To that end, Pentax has delivered what Pentax users wanted.

If you really really really want more automatic in-camera sharpening for your JPG's, you need another make of camera, not Pentax.

If you are happy with the best DSLR camera on the planet (IMHO), then you need to shoot RAW, RAW, RAW.

The desired image does not end when the mirror returns to normal, there is still work to be done later. That takes time and practice and investment in decent post-processing software to get it how you want it.

Peter I agree 100%

It would be nice however just to have that little extra in camera setting.

PENTAX !!!! upgrade our firmware !!!

Pete can you recommend a top notch RAW editor other than silkypix and PS ??

One problem I am having is when I view a jpeg in windows picture and fax viewer the image looks nice and almost right but when I open it in Photoshop it looks murky and totally different. When I tweak and save and view the final result in windows viewer again the same happens. I am sure there is a simple answer. My cousin has the same problem.

Pete

My cousin is coming round my house this afternoon with his Canon E 400 we are going to to some side by side testing.

I will post the results later

Pete

Penatx have upgraded our firmware twice. More in-camera sharpening is not high(not present) on the wish list of most users.

Phase-Ones Capture One LE but wait for the next release as K10D is not yet supported.

Check your Photoshop colour space is the same as your camera.

What are you testing for Pete? Make sure the Canon jpegs are 'sharp' and the Pentax ones are 'soft' - in your opinion of course?

Or are you testing that you can post process a RAW file from either into a sharp image?

Good luck...

just going to take shots in jpeg same settings etc..etc..

testing sharpness difference and other factors. Then post here for some unbiased opinions if thats at all possible

How is this done Peter ??

Sorry for being a bit thick

Chris, you are now doing what you accuse me of doing - seizing on a "questionable assertion" and making "a tiringly snide remark".

And whilst there was everything wrong with Pete's assumption, there was nothing wrong with mine. Posters on DPReview are a very, very small subset of Pentax users, with arguably a rather different take on things from that of most users. Certainly, their obsessions are not mirrored by that other small set of Pentax users that hangs out here.

Note that I didn't say that a majority ISN'T concerned, I was just pointing out that Pete can't draw that conclusion from DPReview.

And this "issue" has been debated a dozen times and more. It doesn't need debating again. The points you say that Pete raised have all been raised before, and addressed before.

Except one. Pete's claim that he hopes to reassure potential buyers is, sadly, rather ruined by the fact that he titled his message: "K10D sharpness still raging (will it ever be put to bed)". People remember headlines, not the article itself. It would have been better, given his intentions, if he had said something like: "Experts agree that K10D is very sharp!"

And finally, my remark was directed at DPReview posters, and the great noise they like to make about trivial matters. If you had been here longer, you would know that I have a rather low opinion of DPReview and the people who hang out there.

G

This is because only Photoshop is colour managed. Most applications are NOT. Don't trust anything else with colour.

Silkypix is colour managed, Capture One is colour managed, Photoshop is colour managed. (You need to read my sticky post on Colour Management - more stuff to learn :roll And you need to set them up correctly too

As far as RAW goes - IMO there are only two candidates for quality: Capture One and SILKYPIX. Capture One does not do DNG or K10D (yet). So there you are. You can take it or leave it Pete

(Adobe Camera RAW has its place, but it still is lower in IQ than Silkypix for all the images I've tried.)


Matt

God why does there always seem to be an heated debate on the horizon between George and myself. It would appear what ever I write George won't agree or very little agreement. Thats his perogative.

I dont think he likes me

Please folk dont miss the point.

Pentax Jpegs are not as sharp as could be from the camera. Not my opinion but so called experts views.

Everything else about the K10d seems top notch in my opinion.

This afternoon I will be provong the K10 is better in many areas the the canon 400 (Hopefully) !!

How much in pounds is Silkypix I only have free version downloaded today (whats the difference in the free and paid version) can't find information on their site of what you gain.

Pete,

Don't worry. I find that whenever you talk sense, we are in full agreement.

Experts don't worry about the K10D's JPEGs because they have the nous to either shoot RAW, or to adjust the default settings, or to sharpen later.

G

Pete, have you experimented with the in-camera sharpness settings, or have you just left it in default?

Pete,
Silkypix differences are here: http://www.isl.co.jp/SILKYPIX/english/products/ds3/function/
(the grey ones are the paid for items. Too many to list here.)

One machine is 12000 Yen is about £53 at today's rate.
You can have up to two extra licenses (e.g. so you can load on laptop and desktop) at 3000 Yen each = about £13.

(If you want Capture One LE, then buy a Compact Flash card Sandisk Extreme III for about £19 which generally includes a Capture One license. Trouble is the update for K10D isn't ready yet... could be a while. But I still prefer Silkypix's level of control and IQ)

Matt

I'd guess that most of us posting on here are fairly biased in favour of Pentax!!!

I only questioned what you are trying to achieve as I struggle to work out what benefit you will gain from learning what you already know or have read. Canon = more agressive in camera jpeg sharpening and Pentax = less agressive jpeg sharpening...

I think everyone reading this thread would agree with that and the advice that you're getting if you're worried about the quality of the Pentax jpegs is to shoot RAW and post process to get the level of sharpening that you want yourself.

Not sure how you'll do that given that they both use different lenses which also have a big impact on image sharpness.

Anyway, I'm sure it will be an entertaining exercise - you'll probably find that the Canon is quite a capable camera. I've certainly found them to be pretty good picture taking machines whenever I've picked one up. Whether they are better than Pentax is a personal opinion and one that for me ultimately comes down to feel and brand loyalty. For me the Pentax feels better, handles the way I like and fits all my old lenses. However, put two prints side by side that have been shot on either camera using RAW and processed and printed well and I doubt I'd pick which was which...

Quick question Pete - are you happy with the results that you get from the K10D? I know I am... and that, more than anything else, counts more than other people's opinions as to what constitutes a sharp result direct from camera or not