K10D Focus issue in electrically dimmed lighting
Posted 02/10/2011 - 23:51
Link
From a very helpful Matt I received the following:
Hi Howard,
I'm not sure I can add much, but I don't fully understand the issues you have!
I feel you might be experiencing separate, unrelated, incidents and 'joining' them together... perhaps.
Some points:
* Hunting in low level light does happen on all bodies.
I don't think it's related to any hardware failure.
o My personal preference for working in challenging conditions is to
disable the Focus-on-Half-Press and only use the "AF" button on the
back of the camera. I almost always use centre focus point as well.
Works like this: point centre to something with some decent contrast at
the point of focus and press AF. Then reframe and shoot (there is no
delay on the shutter at all)
o Depending on the wavelength/colourbalance of the light, the body may
front or back focus a bit. This is especially evident with low level
tungsten lighting. The K7 + K5 bodies include a colour temperature
sensor that's coupled to the AF chip to compensate (to some degree).
o As you say, providing extra light for the focus point is helpful -
like the spot AF from the flash.
* Camera 'lock-ups'
o The camera is a complex computer and can occasionally lockup. The
manual mentions this - you may have to remove the battery to get it
out of that state. (But this shouldn't happen repeatedly)
o Check that you are using decent batteries (preferably genuine ones). I
always use Pentax batteries and have only had perhaps one lock up in
all my years through *ist-D, K10D, K20D, K7, K5
+ Check that the battery contacts are clean too!
o As a firmware engineer, I find it extremely unlikely that the lighting
conditions would contribute to the camera locking up - it's much more
likely to be some other environmental issue - e.g. temperature, dirty
batteries, failed battery - or a hardware failure (like a bad joint on
the PCB soldering that shows itself under certain positions,
temperatures etc). Certainly focus hunting has nothing to do with
lock-up issues at all.
I certainly don't know of any general problem that even remotely fits your descriptions. There have been minor issues over the years (e.g. sensor staining on K5 with early batches - fixed under warranty, no issues now).
Are these lock ups regular? If you've only experienced one - then this is almost impossible for an engineer to locate! If it's regular, you'll need to pin it down further... but try the batteries etc first.
Hope that helps a little....
Matt
Hi Howard,
I'm not sure I can add much, but I don't fully understand the issues you have!
I feel you might be experiencing separate, unrelated, incidents and 'joining' them together... perhaps.
Some points:
* Hunting in low level light does happen on all bodies.
I don't think it's related to any hardware failure.
o My personal preference for working in challenging conditions is to
disable the Focus-on-Half-Press and only use the "AF" button on the
back of the camera. I almost always use centre focus point as well.
Works like this: point centre to something with some decent contrast at
the point of focus and press AF. Then reframe and shoot (there is no
delay on the shutter at all)
o Depending on the wavelength/colourbalance of the light, the body may
front or back focus a bit. This is especially evident with low level
tungsten lighting. The K7 + K5 bodies include a colour temperature
sensor that's coupled to the AF chip to compensate (to some degree).
o As you say, providing extra light for the focus point is helpful -
like the spot AF from the flash.
* Camera 'lock-ups'
o The camera is a complex computer and can occasionally lockup. The
manual mentions this - you may have to remove the battery to get it
out of that state. (But this shouldn't happen repeatedly)
o Check that you are using decent batteries (preferably genuine ones). I
always use Pentax batteries and have only had perhaps one lock up in
all my years through *ist-D, K10D, K20D, K7, K5
+ Check that the battery contacts are clean too!
o As a firmware engineer, I find it extremely unlikely that the lighting
conditions would contribute to the camera locking up - it's much more
likely to be some other environmental issue - e.g. temperature, dirty
batteries, failed battery - or a hardware failure (like a bad joint on
the PCB soldering that shows itself under certain positions,
temperatures etc). Certainly focus hunting has nothing to do with
lock-up issues at all.
I certainly don't know of any general problem that even remotely fits your descriptions. There have been minor issues over the years (e.g. sensor staining on K5 with early batches - fixed under warranty, no issues now).
Are these lock ups regular? If you've only experienced one - then this is almost impossible for an engineer to locate! If it's regular, you'll need to pin it down further... but try the batteries etc first.
Hope that helps a little....
Matt
Posted 03/10/2011 - 00:28
Link
Re: K10D locking up repeatedly when stage lighting in the frame (at one particular angle)
Thanks Matt.
I'll copy your comments to Camtronic's Customer Services Manager, where the K10D is now. Besides physical faults, as you suggest, I understand Camtonics are also considering further main board and aperture control unit trouble.
In brief:
The body locked up 5 or 7 times repeatedly when I attempted one
particular shot of a lead singer from one particular position.
I restarted the camera (to one side) after each occasion the body locked up, before my next attempt.
Battery & body are Pentax and in good order, at the time of the lock
ups the battery had plenty of charge. (It recycled the built in
flash OK, when I tried it). General contact type problems have not
been noticed, the camera had worked reliably all afternoon before giving trouble in the evening.
In more detail
Focus hunting:
Thanks for the info.
Since using the Metz focus assist beam, I've had no low light focus
issues (but not returned to the original venue that gave the
trouble). I mentioned this issue mainly for historical reasons and
note the K10D body is potentially sensitive to switching (dimmed) lighting.
Lock ups:
My current (known) problem is that this K10D body locked up 5 or 7
times.
Leaving no image or exif file after the lock ups.
*** The lock ups occurred 'each' time I was at (or very close to) one
position in front of a stage, with one view (or very similar view) in
the view finder.
I was near centre stage, (lead singer close and directly in front of
me).
Stage lighting facing forward in the RHS half of the image area and shining across my view at an angle, I'm guessing today the lamps were on something like 135° away from me (45° from sensor plane).
It was an open air event and night time.
I remember later attempts cleared the problem quicker, I probably had resorted to opening the battery door as a 'reset'.
Battery in K10D body
A good genuine original Pentax rechargeable battery in good state of
charge at time of lock-ups. It's a good battery.
Using the external flash in other positions around the stage all worked fine.
Each and every lock up was from a very close to identical
location and with a close to identical view.
Metz 40MZ-2 with SCA 3702 (MKII, I think)
Bought the adapter as per your suggestion years ago and has been
great to use (head always set to Auto!).
With the K10D locked up, on the occasion I tried the Metz manual test
button it would not fire the flash. At this point the Metz was quickly removed
from the body, but this did not solve the problem.
Batteries: old(long time stored) but still recharging the head within 5/6 seconds
Temperature. It was an open air event on a pleasant evening a couple of months ago, usual handling with no lengthy position holds
Thanks for advising this is not a known issue. I assumed it was and a straight forward repair.
Best regards
Howard
Thanks Matt.
I'll copy your comments to Camtronic's Customer Services Manager, where the K10D is now. Besides physical faults, as you suggest, I understand Camtonics are also considering further main board and aperture control unit trouble.
In brief:
The body locked up 5 or 7 times repeatedly when I attempted one
particular shot of a lead singer from one particular position.
I restarted the camera (to one side) after each occasion the body locked up, before my next attempt.
Battery & body are Pentax and in good order, at the time of the lock
ups the battery had plenty of charge. (It recycled the built in
flash OK, when I tried it). General contact type problems have not
been noticed, the camera had worked reliably all afternoon before giving trouble in the evening.
In more detail
Focus hunting:
Thanks for the info.
Since using the Metz focus assist beam, I've had no low light focus
issues (but not returned to the original venue that gave the
trouble). I mentioned this issue mainly for historical reasons and
note the K10D body is potentially sensitive to switching (dimmed) lighting.
Lock ups:
My current (known) problem is that this K10D body locked up 5 or 7
times.
Leaving no image or exif file after the lock ups.
*** The lock ups occurred 'each' time I was at (or very close to) one
position in front of a stage, with one view (or very similar view) in
the view finder.
I was near centre stage, (lead singer close and directly in front of
me).
Stage lighting facing forward in the RHS half of the image area and shining across my view at an angle, I'm guessing today the lamps were on something like 135° away from me (45° from sensor plane).
It was an open air event and night time.
I remember later attempts cleared the problem quicker, I probably had resorted to opening the battery door as a 'reset'.
Battery in K10D body
A good genuine original Pentax rechargeable battery in good state of
charge at time of lock-ups. It's a good battery.
Using the external flash in other positions around the stage all worked fine.
Each and every lock up was from a very close to identical
location and with a close to identical view.
Metz 40MZ-2 with SCA 3702 (MKII, I think)
Bought the adapter as per your suggestion years ago and has been
great to use (head always set to Auto!).
With the K10D locked up, on the occasion I tried the Metz manual test
button it would not fire the flash. At this point the Metz was quickly removed
from the body, but this did not solve the problem.
Batteries: old(long time stored) but still recharging the head within 5/6 seconds
Temperature. It was an open air event on a pleasant evening a couple of months ago, usual handling with no lengthy position holds
Thanks for advising this is not a known issue. I assumed it was and a straight forward repair.
Best regards
Howard
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7 posts
15 years
There is no file at all from the time of lock up and getting the body working again was matter of playing with it. I thought Camtronics would have no problem fixing this and did not make notes and forget the exact details now. Any suggestions or questions? To have this body working reliably would be really helpful. Thanks!!
A bit of history this K10D was brought back to life by a great response from Domestic & General, Camtronics & Johnson Photopia. Having gone through the fun of Hypermanual exposure erm.. not quite getting things right, focus hunting at venues with electrically dimmed lighting on the second exposure taking press of the shutter button, (some really great help from this site, Thanx MattMatic!!) Getting me to use my Metz's red focus beam solved the trouble. But then the whole unit simply becoming unuseable at close nephew's wedding the hardly used body got left to one side for a while. Then off to Camtronoics, this year.