K-3ii upgrade to K-3iii


RobL

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 22:00
pschlute wrote:
Aitch53 wrote:


You're missing the main one for most of the members of this board: Doesn't have Pentax written on it.

A bit like Leica fan-boys and the little red dot...



It seems to me that most complaints come from people who have almost decided that Pentax is no longer for them , but cannot quite make their minds up.

I cannot for the life of me understand why they are waiting.

I hope you didn’t misunderstand me, if Pentax continues I am more than happy to stay with it as I haven’t seen anything worth switching to for what I do and I like the kit. I am just holding fire on further expenditure whilst I see how things pan out. As for the red dot, I admit to having succumbed!

richandfleur

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 22:40
JAK wrote:

Lack of backward compatibility;
No TTL viewfinder;
Can't see the back screen when it is sunny to frame the shot;
Menu systems leaving you to trawl through various layers just to change modes rather than have a programmable button for it.

- Mirrorless is compatible with many legacy lens mounts, via adaptors. There's potentially more backwards compatibility there than Pentax.
- No TTL viewfinder no, because there's no mirror. That's why an EVF is provided, and this shows the exact depth of field because it's what the sensor is actually seeing, not an approximation. That then allows for the likes of Eye AF, digital zoom and focus peaking focusing aids.
- Can't see the back screen when sunny on a DSLR either, and again that's why the EVF is provided.
- Many cameras have programmable buttons and dials.

Again, mirrorless cameras have more in common with DSLRs than different, as they both still have mechanical shutters to take the shot.

To me this isn't a mirrorless discussion though, more a where is Pentax going and when will they update their ageing lines of 645 and K-3 models.
It's about staying current with the industry, rather than slipping into oblivion really.

You've got Pentax customers, who want to buy Pentax, but they're not providing any new material for those customers to purchase.
As their existing cameras come up for renewal, they'll go elsewhere, not through wanting to but out of necessity because Pentax hasn't kept up.
Last Edited by richandfleur on 11/09/2019 - 22:42

JAK

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 22:54
Pentax DSLRs are certainly more hands on than the current mirrorless offerings. The camera doesn't do it all for you. I presume for some that's a plus but clearly a negative for others.
Having come from the era when nothing was auto (my first camera was a Halina 35X used along with a handheld exposure meter or an exposure calculator and my second ws a Zenith-E with a built in, but not linked selenium meter.) I opted for an ME when it became available not for its auto exposure feature but for its diminutive weight and size. I've found auto features can make me lazy and tend to take for granted what the camera chooses which isn't always the optimum. Umpteen focus points,, far too fiddly. Do I really want to turn on an eyebrow wink feature? - No thanks. Then have to remember to turn it off again. Do some really want all that fiddling around to take a photo? The new features sound great but in reality how useful are they or is it just hype to sell the camera?


Quote:
That's why an EVF is provided, and this shows the exact depth of field because it's what the sensor is actually seeing, not an approximation.

Do you want to know how to stop the lens down on a Pentax to see the DOF? It's very simple. Maybe you're not fully appreciating the DSLR features and concept and it can do more than you realise? I can't see why you bought into DSLRs when you hate the concept so much.
John K
Last Edited by JAK on 11/09/2019 - 23:04

TerryL

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 23:38
pschlute wrote:
Don wrote:
I was very loyal for decades, but now feel betrayed.

Loyalty, when it comes to consumer purchases is a very outdated concept. When my insurance supplier ramps up my renewal quote I tell them it is too much and if they dont reduce it I leave for another supplier.

I use Pentax for two reasons:

First, the current equipment on sale is perfect for my photographic needs. K1 plus 4 modern zooms and 1 modern prime is more than enough. The FA Ltd's and FA* older lenses fill in any prime gaps.
Secondly, I am a Pentax collector and being able to use the old K/ M/ A lenses is fun too.

I understand that not everyone has the same photographic needs and that if video is your thing, or require the fastest AF for sports/wildlife then you really should have switched brands years ago.

Betrayed ! We are talking about consumer electronics here. If a company does not give you what you want then buy a product from someone who does.

TerryL

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 23:40
I agree, completly.
TerryL wrote:
I agree, completly.

Don

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 23:52
pschlute wrote:
Don wrote:
I was very loyal for decades, but now feel betrayed.

Loyalty, when it comes to consumer purchases is a very outdated concept....
Betrayed ! We are talking about consumer electronics here. If a company does not give you what you want then buy a product from someone who does.

I disagree we’re not talking about a clock radio or insurance policy here.. we’re talking about buying into an ecosystem... you buy the cameras lenses flashes and many other accessories on the assumption that most of the money you invest in the system will be well spent when the next upgrade comes along.
Being forced to dump decades of gear for want of one feature all the other competitors include... is a betrayal actually.
Fired many shots. Didn't kill anything.

richandfleur

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 23:56
Quote:
I can't see why you bought into DSLRs when you hate the concept so much.

Please try not to make this personal. Yes I know how to use the DoF preview feature, and no I don't hate DSLRs. My comments are that DSLR vs Mirrorless is just two sides of a coin, they're very similar and each with pros and cons depending on what you are shooting.

I personally prefer optical viewfinders, but do accept that EVF's have come a long way since their early days too. I also realise that most of my landscape/tripod based work is all on the rear lcd screen in live view. Just personal observations.

As for auto features, you can chose if you want to use them or not, just like we can with the variety of auto options already provided on current Pentax cameras. Point is for those who want them, they can be handy tools, even if others don't use or value those features.

As above, this is not a mirrorless discussion though, it's about a K-3ii upgrade to K-3iii, and what type of camera that might be.
Which areas would you want Pentax to develop further in?
Last Edited by richandfleur on 11/09/2019 - 23:56

JAK

Link Posted 12/09/2019 - 00:08
Quote:
Which areas would you want Pentax to develop further in?

Personally, I'm not missing anything! A happy bunny.
John K

pschlute

Link Posted 12/09/2019 - 01:43
Don wrote:

I disagree we’re not talking about a clock radio or insurance policy here.. we’re talking about buying into an ecosystem... you buy the cameras lenses flashes and many other accessories on the assumption that most of the money you invest in the system will be well spent when the next upgrade comes along.
Being forced to dump decades of gear for want of one feature all the other competitors include... is a betrayal actually.

I get that your K3 is old and knackered and you want a new camera. The KP does not work for you. So sell your Pentax kit and buy something else.

You bought your K3 in 2013 ? I am surprised it has taken 6 years to realise that Pentax is a small producer.

You got no guarantee in 2013 about future product and if they bring out a new aps-c camera in 2020 you wont get a guarantee about future product either.

Cut your losses before it is too late and spare us the moans.
Peter



My Flickr page

michaelblue

Link Posted 12/09/2019 - 09:20
richandfleur wrote:

Which areas would you want Pentax to develop further in?

Autofocus tracking
Autofocus tracking
Autofocus tracking

Everything else is excellent
Regards,
Michael
My new website:link

Don

Link Posted 12/09/2019 - 20:01
pschlute wrote:
Don wrote:

I disagree we’re not talking about a clock radio or insurance policy here.. we’re talking about buying into an ecosystem... you buy the cameras lenses flashes and many other accessories on the assumption that most of the money you invest in the system will be well spent when the next upgrade comes along.
Being forced to dump decades of gear for want of one feature all the other competitors include... is a betrayal actually.

I get that your K3 is old and knackered and you want a new camera. The KP does not work for you. So sell your Pentax kit and buy something else.

You bought your K3 in 2013 ? I am surprised it has taken 6 years to realise that Pentax is a small producer.

You got no guarantee in 2013 about future product and if they bring out a new aps-c camera in 2020 you wont get a guarantee about future product either.

Cut your losses before it is too late and spare us the moans.

Been on this forum as long as you, maybe longer.... Pentax shooter for 35 years.
Don't bother condescending to me, I already switched brands.... got nothing to lose if I say something to get myself banned here... lol!
as for guarantees.... there's still people out there shooting on glass plates, and developing in chemicals....
is that really the kind of niche market Pentax is looking for?
Pentax driving long time loyal customers like me away, isn't just cutting their own sales... while bolstering their competitors sales.... its also driving away other lens makers....

link
Fired many shots. Didn't kill anything.

pschlute

Link Posted 12/09/2019 - 20:51
Don wrote:


Been on this forum as long as you, maybe longer.... Pentax shooter for 35 years.

I bought my first Pentax in 1979.

I have said many times I get why you are unhappy. Perhaps Pentax gives up the ghost and packs it in for good.

My point is dont hang around the forums like a ghost without a home. Move on and embrace your new equipment. I will do that in an instant if Pentax no longer serves my needs.

I am questioning why you feel the need to say you have moved faway from Pentax but still want to come back here and remind us we are using a minority brand. Most of us realise that already
Peter



My Flickr page

JAK

Link Posted 12/09/2019 - 21:08
Don wrote:
Don't bother condescending to me, I already switched brands....

Are you still visiting here to try and be helpful by imparting your 35 years experience or to venge Ricoh/Pentax for some reason? Just curious?
John K
Last Edited by JAK on 12/09/2019 - 21:11

Don

Link Posted 12/09/2019 - 23:01
ultimately if Pentax fails it'll be becuase they're listening to feedback from SOME people that are adverse to change, as opposed to trying to understand why people left...

from a post I made in 2013:
Quote:
Don wrote:
richandfleur wrote:
I do think the add ons, whilst not necessarily desired by all are what's going to get Pentax to shape up on the spec comparison sheet. Once you can start doing that, people will look at the IQ and be impressed. Now I know that's back to front for most, but growing the brand means getting more people in...

Pentax is severely behind the 8 ball on video. I'm not sure if it's a lack of processing power, or a lack of focus, but the bit rates etc are nearly half of Canon straight out of the box. The K-30 doesn't have mechanical stabilisation during video. There is no focus peaking during recording. There's no attempt at autofocus during recording etc etc.

Wifi and GPS are where it's headed, so getting some of the cool stuff from Ricoh's lower point and shoot type cameras into it's Pentax DSLR's will really start to draw them in. FF would be a nice to have, but it's not as if they've exhausted what they can do with their current line up.

I'd be incredibly happy to see a Pentax D-slr AND mirror-less camera come out with three things....
more dynamic range, better low light performance and a touch screen, better video (including raw video out through hdmi while recording. just gut the existing models and improve everything...
but also accessory grips that add a live second memory card, battery, wi-fi, and better sound including mic and headphone jacks.
take the k5 and k01 and add hdmi, usb3 or thunderbolt connectivity... put ALL the ports on the camera bottom with a removable rubber cover, and then bring out accessory grips... one specifically for video with tablet connectivity, one less expensive model for stills.
put all the add ons in the grips, and keep the bodies affordable...... let people build the system the way they intend to use them.


The sony A7iii didn't come out until April 2018, which was a lot of time for Pentax to act.
Failing to listen to it's customers THEN landed the last $15000.00 in camera and lens purchases by me to Sony this year...

You call it whining, I call it constructive criticism, becuase if the company goes under now, it's YOU'RE problem, not mine.
Fired many shots. Didn't kill anything.
Last Edited by Don on 12/09/2019 - 23:03

pschlute

Link Posted 12/09/2019 - 23:27
Don wrote:


from a post I made in 2013...............


You call it whining, I call it constructive criticism, because if the company goes under now, it's YOU'RE problem, not mine.

Don, you make my point for me. You have sat around for six years with camera equipment that you are not happy with. No wonder you are bitter.

If Pentax stops making product tomorrow I will move to another brand. I will say farewell to my friends here. I will not keep coming back to bemoan the choices I have made
Peter



My Flickr page
Last Edited by pschlute on 12/09/2019 - 23:29
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