K-3ii upgrade to K-3iii


richandfleur

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 02:07
JAK wrote:

DSLRs will never be best at video, the mirror just happens to get in the way. So the camera has to go into a mirrorless mode to do video. That's always going to be second best for that purpose.

Huh? Just fold the mirror up and you're good to go. No different to Live View on the rear screen.
Pentax K-70 has on sensor Phase Detection AF points, to allow for decent AF during video and live view purposes.

DSLR for video isn't a new thing, it's been around for 10 years now.
https://petapixel.com/2010/04/09/house-season-finale-filmed-entirely-with-canon-...

JAK wrote:

Try using a mirrorless camera as a proper TTL DSLR? It doesn't work does it? Can't be done. In that instance the mirrorless is second best.

Again, with digital zoom and focus peaking in the viewfinder or on the rear screen, mirrorless can be a lot easier to use with manual lenses than a DSLR.


Mirrorless and DSLRs have more in common than different. Just talking mirror/optical viewfinder vs EVF/rear screen and AF unit vs on sensor AF points. Pros and cons to each approach, but I personally don't see enough to be blindly passionate one way or another. After those differences comes all the common supporting content, such as body shape ergonomics, weather sealing, lens ecosystem, battery size, dual card slots, video capability, WiFi, IBIS and IBIS features like pixelshift and high res modes, flash support, tracking AF, raw bit depth etc, ISO noise, max shutter speed, menu system clarity, customisable buttons and wheels/dials, ongoing firmware support and feature enhancements, after sales support and ease of use etc.
Last Edited by richandfleur on 11/09/2019 - 02:25

RobL

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 07:50
Sorry if I sounded a bit gloomy, it was gone midnight and I should have been in bed. Jak is right on many points but unlike 35mm cameras DSLRs have a limited life so at some point will need replacing. And I have started using prime lenses more so there is scope for a couple which is where I am saving more weight than just going mirrorless would. But Jak we live in a commercial world and stagnation doesnít send out positive signals as well as limiting appeal to new buyers.

Sigma ceasing production of K mounts isnít a surprise as none of their new lenses for the last three years have the option, and demand for their older lenses is bound to be falling off anyway. Instead they are capitalising on the growth of Sony and the other mirrorless systems where there are large gaps in the native line ups.

Don

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 13:32
richandfleur wrote:
JAK wrote:

DSLRs will never be best at video, the mirror just happens to get in the way. So the camera has to go into a mirrorless mode to do video. That's always going to be second best for that purpose.

Huh? Just fold the mirror up and you're good to go. No different to Live View on the rear screen.
Pentax K-70 has on sensor Phase Detection AF points, to allow for decent AF during video and live view purposes.

DSLR for video isn't a new thing, it's been around for 10 years now.
https://petapixel.com/2010/04/09/house-season-finale-filmed-entirely-with-canon-...

JAK wrote:

Try using a mirrorless camera as a proper TTL DSLR? It doesn't work does it? Can't be done. In that instance the mirrorless is second best.

Again, with digital zoom and focus peaking in the viewfinder or on the rear screen, mirrorless can be a lot easier to use with manual lenses than a DSLR.


Mirrorless and DSLRs have more in common than different. Just talking mirror/optical viewfinder vs EVF/rear screen and AF unit vs on sensor AF points. Pros and cons to each approach, but I personally don't see enough to be blindly passionate one way or another. After those differences comes all the common supporting content, such as body shape ergonomics, weather sealing, lens ecosystem, battery size, dual card slots, video capability, WiFi, IBIS and IBIS features like pixelshift and high res modes, flash support, tracking AF, raw bit depth etc, ISO noise, max shutter speed, menu system clarity, customisable buttons and wheels/dials, ongoing firmware support and feature enhancements, after sales support and ease of use etc.

theoretically, one could actually build a mirror box and pentaprism viewer with lens mount adapter for a mirrorless system.... but I guess there's been no demand, or it would already exist.
Pentax's own lx system was fully modular back in the day... today it's possible to have a sensor back, choice of either an empty spacer, speed booster or mirror box, choice of EVF or pentaprism viewer and choice of lens mount on a fully modular camera...
Pentax spends all their time looking back, but fails to see where the market is going, moving forward....
the 645 system COULD have been years ahead of RED for the pro film market. if they had built ANYTHING with decent video specs they'd have gotten all the money I spent with Sony... I was very loyal for decades, but now feel betrayed.
Fired many shots. Didn't kill anything.
Last Edited by Don on 11/09/2019 - 13:46

pschlute

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 14:10
Don wrote:
I was very loyal for decades, but now feel betrayed.

Loyalty, when it comes to consumer purchases is a very outdated concept. When my insurance supplier ramps up my renewal quote I tell them it is too much and if they dont reduce it I leave for another supplier.

I use Pentax for two reasons:

First, the current equipment on sale is perfect for my photographic needs. K1 plus 4 modern zooms and 1 modern prime is more than enough. The FA Ltd's and FA* older lenses fill in any prime gaps.
Secondly, I am a Pentax collector and being able to use the old K/ M/ A lenses is fun too.

I understand that not everyone has the same photographic needs and that if video is your thing, or require the fastest AF for sports/wildlife then you really should have switched brands years ago.

Betrayed ! We are talking about consumer electronics here. If a company does not give you what you want then buy a product from someone who does.
Peter



My Flickr page

JAK

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 14:56
How can anyone be 'betrayed' by a camera manufacturer? (Maybe if copies of all your images were sent to them and any 'naughty' ones were sent to the authorities for further action, however I'm not aware of that happening with Pentax. )

Even if Hoya hadn't sold the Pentax camera division on and the brand had simply ceased it still wouldn't have betrayed anyone. Were we betrayed by Woolworths when it went bust? Or BHS? etc. Pentax DSLR cameras are basically a digital continuation of the film cameras bearing the same brand name with some incorporating a limited concession to recording video. If people had stopped buying the brand they surely would have ceased production? I can see they may not be for everyone and if they're not for you just get something that is. Simple! No point in complaining that you made a mistake, it just shows a lack of product research. If it was right at the time of purchase but not now it is your requirement that has changed, that's not the camera or Pentax's fault if it still does what it was made to do.

One has to decide if it is a DSLR that is required or a mirrorless offering and buy accordingly. You can only complain and blame yourself if you got that decision wrong. Pentax DSLRs (nor anyone else's to my knowledge) have ever offered the facilities some suggest that they should have. Perhaps in the future they will but until then there is just what there is and if it isn't what you want get something that suits or show patience and wait!

I'm sure people in the 1970s wouldn't have bought a Super 8 camera to do stills, or an Instamatic to make movies. They'd have got the right one for their needs and looked a bit stupid if they had complained about their wrong decision.

Perhaps my television ought to make me a cup of coffee in the morning... It doesn't, I shall have to complain.
John K
Last Edited by JAK on 11/09/2019 - 15:15

Don

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 15:59
betrayed is how you feel when you invest craploads into a system and then have to dump it and start over because the brand doesn't stay competitive with what ALL it's competitors are doing...
like it or not investing in a gun company that insists on making the finest muskets in the industry long after everybody else has moved on to automatic weapons is gonna force people to switch gun makers.....
Pentax isn't just harming itself and it's loyal customers, they're bolstering sales to a juggrnaught competitor that is going to eat up market share and take more customers from Pentax....
Fired many shots. Didn't kill anything.

JAK

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 16:29
Suppose you're entltled to you opinion, free speech and all that, however do you know what betrayal actually implies? It's far deeper than anything to do with buying a camera! It's more to do with exposing one's country, a group, or a person to danger by treacherously giving information to an enemy. So I simply don't see your correlation. Can you explain how you've been exposed to danger by Pentax cameras not offering the features you desire?
John K
Last Edited by JAK on 11/09/2019 - 16:30

RobL

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 16:30
Loyalty is to an extent looking after your own interests, after all the advice glibly given of changing systems doesnít compare to insurance policies or single items. I am sure camera bodies are almost loss leaders as once you have bought into a brand you keep buying stuff; most of us have a range of lenses and accessories which cost a lot more than the camera itself and probably accumulated over several years. Replacing them is a huge financial hit especially if there is no longer a market for them and which would be unnecessary if Pentax stays in business unless you choose to for other reasons.

JAK

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 16:42
RobL wrote:
Loyalty is to an extent looking after your own interests, after all the advice glibly given of changing systems doesnít compare to insurance policies or single items. I am sure camera bodies are almost loss leaders as once you have bought into a brand you keep buying stuff; most of us have a range of lenses and accessories which cost a lot more than the camera itself and probably accumulated over several years. Replacing them is a huge financial hit especially if there is no longer a market for them and which would be unnecessary if Pentax stays in business unless you choose to for other reasons.

There are folk who still enjoy using their film SLRs and even pre-war rangefinder cameras. All out of production.
A K-1 won't suddenly become unusable because it can't do spot the wink pictures. There's every chance it will continue its life long after we're all gone like those pre-war range-finder cameras that have outlived their owners.
If one buys lenses wisely it is even possible to make a profit when you sell them on. However a fool and his money are soon parted.

One thing people musn't forget, we've been in a recession which has seen a huge number of businesses over reach themselves and fold. Camera makers are not exempt from that and need to ride the storm.
John K
Last Edited by JAK on 11/09/2019 - 16:46

pschlute

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 16:49
RobL wrote:
Replacing them is a huge financial hit especially if there is no longer a market for them

I accept it is a big financial commitment to change brands and will cost money. But if your current product does not satisfy you then change you must. Sell your old kit and buy the new one.

There is a very healthy market for old Pentax gear.
Peter



My Flickr page

JAK

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 16:59
pschlute wrote:
RobL wrote:
Replacing them is a huge financial hit especially if there is no longer a market for them

I accept it is a big financial commitment to change brands and will cost money. But if your current product does not satisfy you then change you must. Sell your old kit and buy the new one.

There is a very healthy market for old Pentax gear.

That sounds simply too obvious! Though some seem to prefer to moan about it instead!
John K
Last Edited by JAK on 11/09/2019 - 17:02

pschlute

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 17:23
JAK wrote:

That sounds simply too obvious! Though some seem to prefer to moan about it instead!

If I had needs that Pentax could not satisfy I would change systems in an instant and buy a product that worked for me.

Life is too short to be bitter about ones previous choices. Moving on can be very cathartic.
Peter



My Flickr page
Last Edited by pschlute on 11/09/2019 - 17:24

JAK

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 17:39
Alternatively one could purchase the camera one's lusting over after all the hype rather than the new Pentax lens that hasn't been released yet and try it out before committing to completely change. Might find out the grass wasn't greener after all.
Pitfalls of other brands:
Lack of backward compatibility;
No TTL viewfinder;
Can't see the back screen when it is sunny to frame the shot;
Menu systems leaving you to trawl through various layers just to change modes rather than have a programmable button for it.
I'm pretty sure more can be added to the list.
5 Questions to Ask Before Switching Camera Brands
John K
Last Edited by JAK on 11/09/2019 - 17:53

Aitch53

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 20:19
JAK wrote:
Alternatively one could purchase the camera one's lusting over after all the hype rather than the new Pentax lens that hasn't been released yet and try it out before committing to completely change. Might find out the grass wasn't greener after all.
Pitfalls of other brands:
Lack of backward compatibility;
No TTL viewfinder;
Can't see the back screen when it is sunny to frame the shot;
Menu systems leaving you to trawl through various layers just to change modes rather than have a programmable button for it.
I'm pretty sure more can be added to the list.
5 Questions to Ask Before Switching Camera Brands

You're missing the main one for most of the members of this board: Doesn't have Pentax written on it.

A bit like Leica fan-boys and the little red dot...



SteveH!

Some people call me 'strange'.
I prefer 'unconventional'.
But I'm willing to compromise and accept 'eccentric'.
Last Edited by Aitch53 on 11/09/2019 - 20:20

pschlute

Link Posted 11/09/2019 - 20:49
Aitch53 wrote:


You're missing the main one for most of the members of this board: Doesn't have Pentax written on it.

A bit like Leica fan-boys and the little red dot...



It seems to me that most complaints come from people who have almost decided that Pentax is no longer for them , but cannot quite make their minds up.

I cannot for the life of me understand why they are waiting.
Peter



My Flickr page
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