eye-watering water-damage repair cost for K5+18-135mm


amoringello

Link Posted 12/08/2013 - 10:48
Been using my K7 and K5 for years in heavy downpours, and even cleaned after events by rinsing with water under the tap (low pressure). Finally sent the K5 in for repair of sensor stain issue (minor enough I lived with it for more than a year).

When it came back and the thing essentially filled with water under a single light rain. (DA* 16-50 lens attached -- a combo that should be, and was up to that point, quite WR).

Obviously the seals were damaged during the repair.

Naturally, Pentax found no flaws and stated the camera was only meant to be water resistant "through mist and light rain". (er, ANY camera , WR or not, can withstand mist or light rain!)
Regardless of the videos of sales reps pouring water over it, Pentax "never heard of such a thing". Yeah, they actually told me that.

Anyway, had to pay for repairs since water damage is not covered under their warranty.

Just be aware that Pentax will not stand behind their product, and be ready to take responsibility if it gets water damaged.

Evel79

Link Posted 12/08/2013 - 19:49
Froeschle,

I think I must have made a mistake about the centre in Munich. There isn't one - it's HAmburg, Berlin or Vechelde - and it is indeed authorised repair centres.

The seller told me I could get in direct contact with the repair centre, but wouldn't tell me to which it was sent (helpful!). They eventually sent the cost breakdown though, attached (repair centre blocked out!). Maybe the German speakers could help here. It looks like they are charging for the replacement of the motherboard and processor - however this cost also includes investigation, which begs the question whether this is just precautionary based on the fact I told them it was used in damp and cold conditions. They also include in their labour costs cleaning the sensor and upgrading the firmware. Well I can clean the sensor or choose my nearby favourite camera centre (Sauter) and the firmware is up-to-date...

For non-german-speakers, it's €252 labour and €285 parts + VAT (letter not attached).

Time to contact Pentax Germany directly to see if they will step in.

By the way, in case it got lost in an earlier post, check out these promo photos by Pentax of the K5ii (scroll down to bottom):
http://www.pentax.eu/en/press-release-K5-II-and-K5-IIs.html

And also check this facebook wall posting from Pentax (13.09.2012). Same weather sealing as K5 isn't it?
"With the K-5 II, you can capture stunning photographs others simply won’t be able to… In rain or shine…and in sleet, sand, dust and snow with PENATAX signature weather sealing. The K-5 II and K-5 IIs are housed in sturdy, magnesium alloy bodies with 77 weather and dustproofing seals. The K-5 II and K-5 IIs are designed for worry-free use in any weather condition—including wet, sub-freezing, and snowy winter conditions. This camera is cold resistant down to 10°C or 14°F, for excellent use in mid-winter, sleet and snowy conditions."

hmmmm, so long as you don't need a warranty repair eh Pentax?

May 22.05.2012 is also interesting, as is their post from 26.07.2013 - where they appear to endorse a review calling the K30 "totally weatherproof"

Sorry - collecting ammo to present Pentax HQ Germany.

ilovesaabs

Link Posted 12/08/2013 - 20:26
Why are they quoting for camera repair and not lens repair (under guarantee)? If water damage was cited for the camera repair wouldn't the same apply to the lens?

Very inconsistent.
AKA Welshwizard/PWynneJ
Assorted Pentax/Nikon/Mamiya stuff

Evel79

Link Posted 12/08/2013 - 20:39
Perhaps because I told them there was nothing wrong with the lens in the covering letter - so they have kindly acknowledged the guarantee would cover that...

I really do get the feeling they have solely relied on my letter, not on any investigation at all. This might be a repair-centre issue rather than Pentax as such, but doesn't give much confidence! There's a lesson here - never give details you don't need to or tell them what you think might or might not be wrong!

I had to send in all original parts of the package. That's why they have it. But you are right - it's ridiculous double standards

froeschle

Link Posted 13/08/2013 - 11:01
Quote:
I think I must have made a mistake about the centre in Munich. There isn't one - it's HAmburg, Berlin or Vechelde

As I told you : https://www.pentaxuser.com/forum/topic/eye-watering-water-damage-repair-cost-for...
Quote:
[...] The corresponding partners are Rüdiger Maerz and TRITEC (see http://www.pentax.de/de/reparaturservice-kompakt.html ). [...] Please note that Rüdiger Maerz is also official partner of Canon CPS - where the policy probably is strictly the same. [...]

If you follow the remark "Ihre Meinung ist uns wichtig: www.canon-europe.com/SurveyA" still all options are available:
* Rüdiger Maerz GmbH - Berlin
* Rüdiger Maerz GmbH - Hamburg
* TRITEC GmbH - Vechelde

All telephone and e-mail numbers are given there:
http://www.pentax.de/de/reparaturservice-kompakt.html

Quote:
[...] but wouldn't tell me to which it was sent (helpful!). [...]

No, it is not (it is fishy) - but you got more than enough information for your enquiry:

Quote:
ID #1217XX (upper right corner)

SV-1108-18XX (bar code)

Order number SG426N-008XX
Service/document number 4670XX
Customer number 1011XX

Serial number 39619XX + 52450XX (body + lens); box 046XX

(Last two digits replaced by XX)

This data should be sufficient to identify the repair centre.
So, after contacting all three possibilities, you should know, where your camera really is.
Just compose an adequate cover letter / telephone call.

Quote:
If water damage was cited for the camera repair wouldn't the same apply to the lens?

The last sentence states that the damage was caused by wetness or water and therefore this cost breakdown was compiled. It seems that they did not (yet) discover any water damage of the lens.

Quote:
Maybe the German speakers could help here. It looks like they are charging for [...]

CAMERA:
Service tasks to be processed: Check & adjust camera, replace main board & wiring, update firmware, clean sensor (IIRC, the first sensor cleaning was/is free. The same might be true for the update. So, these formulations might be standard.).

LENS: (warranty)
Service tasks to be processed: Check & adjust lens

Quote:
however this cost also includes investigation

Normally, this is why you have to pay a fee if you want the camera back unrepaired.


PS: According to e.g.
https://www.shopauskunft.de/bewertung/AVIDES_Media_AG--S-12227.html
Avides seems not to have the best reputation concerning service, support and customer complaints.

froeschle

Link Posted 13/08/2013 - 12:49
http://forum.digitalfotonetz.de/viewtopic.php?p=1300987#1300987

There is some hope (translation):

"I had the same problems last year (K5 + WR 50-200).

The camera was sent to Maerz and came back unrepaired as write-off: Water damage of the electronics.
I then directly contacted Pentax (Hamburg) and asked about the meaning of "sealed".

They wanted to inspect the camera themselves. So, I sent it to them. Two weeks later I got a replacement camera from "repair stock" (shutter count: 7000)."

Evel79

Link Posted 16/08/2013 - 16:53
Thanks again froeschle,

Avides have actually been pretty good to a point. I've sent them about 12 emails and they always respond within 24 hours and they know I've got Pentax Germany/EU involved and have extended my decision making deadline without fuss.

My only issue is they say they don't give the contact details of their partners (repair centre) due to data protection. This just sounds like someone with no sense of how to apply their rules. That's my only real frustration with them. I'm walking the line between needing them to help when Pentax come knocking and not pissing them off with my increasingly impatient emails!

Pentax DE/EU have at least responded asking for the quotation and to be put into contact with the repaircentre, so hopefully something good comes out of that.

Evel79

Link Posted 20/08/2013 - 22:28
Update for anyone interested or following this.

After requesting the invoice posted on this forum, Pentax now have sent me the following:
"We are sorry to hear that you are having problems with your camera.

We will need to forward your issue to a higer level of support. We will contact you back as soon as we have an answer for you."

All a bit blah blah blah to be honest - escalations departments seem to be de rigeur these days. Seems to be one step away from customer services and what might previously have been called "complaints".

Hopefully the "escalations department" does the right thing.

I'll try and wheedle a confirmation of the extent of the weatherproofness/resistanceness out of them whatever happens.

tyronet2000

Link Posted 20/08/2013 - 22:35
I do hope this has a satisfactory conclusion for you. I was out in the rain with my K-5 and 18-135mm on Saturday and recollections of this thread kept coming to mind. Pleased to report have had no ill effects to camera or lens, but don't think I'll tempt fate too often with foul weather photography
Regards
Stan

PPG

Evel79

Link Posted 22/08/2013 - 17:33
well it gets better:

Pentax's final decision is: We suggest you contact the Pentax service partner. I hope that your question has been answered to your satisfaction.

So a quick call to Pentax EU technical service desk and they consider the case closed. I ask why as they haven't given a decision, to which they say yes we have in the email I argue my case to them again to which they say that the repair centre has made their decision and they ARE Pentax. I politely suggest that they certainly are not. A few no they're not yes they ares, and I ask why they also repair cannon. Answer: um OK they're not Pentax. I suggest they actually do what they promised to do last week and contact the repair centre.

I also ask: if a camera used in the conditions described lets water in somehow, that could be due to a camera failing, couldn't it? That would be a warranty issue then, wouldn't it? What are the seals designed to do? And also what about the older unrelated issue - all the repair centre say is they want to replace all the internals.

To which pentax reply: I'll pass it on to a team member to look into. I asked whether they had contacted the centre with the details passed on by the seller - erm I can't access that email (but oddly he could a few minutes before for another question)

Apart from the terrible service, they completely dodged my questions about whether a failing that led to water damage would be a warranty issue. Not forgetting at this stage I only have the repair centre's word for it that it's water damage - and that's because I told them I used it in the rain.

I assumed Pentax would be better at dealing with their customers as they are "smaller" than the big 2 - at least counting only cameras and not fax machines.

Repair centre have now had the camera for two weeks and want to send it back (or bin it), so hoping my hand won't be forced.

Feel like posting their final final decision on their facebook wall when the inevitable comes.

johnriley

Link Posted 22/08/2013 - 17:41
I'm still slightly concerned that the camera hasn't actually been examined thoroughly yet. You're the one who has told them it's water damage and they may just have taken your word for it at this stage.

The process isn't working properly at the moment - my action would have been to send it in for warranty repair when there was a fault showing, rather than to ask to have it checked in case there was a fault. That latter method can easily be seen as not a warranty claim. Checking over a camera just in case isn't a warranty issue is it?
Best regards, John

Algernon

Link Posted 22/08/2013 - 17:46
I noticed on the Ricoh Japanese site last week that they have offered
to repair cameras damaged in some storms/flooding at 50% of the normal charge, but with the full postage charge.

--
Half Man... Half Pentax ... Half Cucumber

Pentax K-1 + K-5 and some other stuff

Algi

Evel79

Link Posted 22/08/2013 - 17:54
Hi John,

Unfortunately I had to wait until I was back from Iceland to post it...

I'm sure we've all been in a similar situation where we've had to wait a few days before complaining about something that has happened to us. That doesn't make it any less serious. The older issue is minor but also wasn't known to be a camera rather than lens issue until about the same time, coincidently, as I was trying out a bunch of new manuals I'd not had a chance to use (and noted a common issue).

Perhaps it just needed the few days break from useage it had to dry out (if that was the issue) and now all is well, but if I've got dodgy seals, then I want them sorted as well as not worrying about longer-term damage - which if I wait could get worse, as you mention.

If my car brakes stop working, but the next day and the day after that they're fine - I'm sure you'd join me in having the seemingly now fine brakes checked out. Off topic, but this did happen to my hydraulic bike brakes - I very nearly came off a mountain: all fixed under service warranty - just because something seems better doesn't mean it is.

giofi

Link Posted 22/08/2013 - 20:31
Hi,

This is silly..... and defies logic

A few years back I had a Canon video camera. It stopped working, out of warranty. I took it to the repair center. Their diagnosis was that they had to change components, but the repair + component price was higher than the value of the camera. So they told me and they asked approval from Canon to repair it for a more reasonable price, which they received.

My point is that besides the issue of whether it is covered by warranty or not, it is plain unacceptable from a customer service point of view to act as they are doing.... It looks as if they do not care about Pentax users. At the end of the day this thread is costing them immensely more than any warranty costs on your camera. they are generating so much negative goodwill and what is worst they do not even figure it out...... Sad!

Now, if instead they had reacted differently, you would writing all over the internet about how great Pentax is and how well they look after their customers.... Think how much that is worth in free advertising!!! again, sad!!
Giorgio

Pentax Photo Gallery
Last Edited by giofi on 22/08/2013 - 20:31

giofi

Link Posted 22/08/2013 - 20:32
giofi wrote:
Hi,

This is silly..... and defies logic

A few years back I had a Canon video camera. It stopped working, out of warranty. I took it to the repair center. Their diagnosis was that they had to change components, but the repair + component price was higher than the value of the camera. So they told me and they asked approval from Canon to repair it for a more reasonable price, which they received.

My point is that besides the issue of whether it is covered by warranty or not, it is plain unacceptable from a customer service point of view to act as they are doing.... It looks as if they do not care about Pentax users. At the end of the day this thread is costing them immensely more than any warranty costs on your camera. they are generating so much negative goodwill and what is worst they do not even figure it out...... Sad!

Now, if instead they had reacted differently, you would writing all over the internet about how great Pentax is and how well they look after their customers.... Think how much that is worth in free advertising!!! again, sad!!

Sorry, I meant to say.... how great Ricoh is. My mistake
Giorgio

Pentax Photo Gallery
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