'Digital only' lenses - are they a good investment


Mannesty

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 08:24
Well I've bitten the bullet as it were. I've ordered the 16-45DA lens from Pixmania.com who have it in stock for £274.00 + £8.00 Delivery.
Peter E Smith

My flickr Photostream

George Lazarette

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 10:55
I think it's high time manuafacturers used AOV instead of focal length to describe a lens, but obviously a lens designed to fit cameras with more than one sensor size will need to mention more than one AOV. There's no really easy solution to this problem.

I have the lens roadmap framed and hanging on the wall, where I can contemplate it with a misty gleam in my eye.

But I have to say that I am a bit worried about the future of the Ltd lenses, because a max ap of f2.4 / 3.2 is a tad disappointing on a prime lens, though the pancake format has its attractions. The f2.8 zooms look very tasty, though.

Personally, I hope that either the existing Limiteds continue, or that fast (non-pancake) versions appear in DA format in the future.

G
Keywords: Charming, polite, and generally agreeable.

niblue

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 12:15
It's my intention to stay away from APS-C only lenses as much as possible because I hope that we do see a move to full (35mm) sized sensors in consumer specification digital bodies. This is mainly because the area most adversely affected by the smaller sensor size is wide angle, and that's what I use most often.

So far I've only two APS-C only lenses (Sigma 10-20 and the Pentax 18-55) and don't particularily intend adding any more, plus I'm keeping hold of the likes of the Tokina ATX-Pro 20-35mm F2.8 (great as an ultra-wide on 35mm but less useful with APS-C) just in case.

Don

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 13:20
I wonder if technology like KM/sony's antishake could be made to work (on one plane/axis) with in camera processor stiching together data from the sensor to capture wider angled images. Ie pivot the sensor to collect more light...or pack more pixels on one chip, but have the additional light receptors angled to the left ang right to collect wider AOV....maybe learn to bend the chip into an arch....
I think APS sized sensors are here to stay...35mm's 24x36 image area never fit the standard 8x10 frames anyways and it hung in there 'till something entirely different came along.
Fired many shots. Didn't kill anything.

Kimbo

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 15:24
George Lazarette wrote:
I think it's high time manuafacturers used AOV instead of focal length to describe a lens
G

I've often thought that myself, particularly as today's lenses are usually smaller (shorter) than their earlier counterparts, zooms in particular. How can two lenses of different physical lengths have the same focal length?
It's the AOV that is the same, not the 'length'.

If my Tamron 24mm (84 degree AOV) was literally half the length of my A50 F2 (47 degree AOV), it would be about 15mm long......now that's what I call a pancake lens!
Die my dear doctor, that's the last thing I shall do!

bretbysteve

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 16:56
Hi all,

If you really do have the lenses which give you the results you need/want then who cares a fig If they are a good investment or not?

The real reason there are two, (or three sensor 'divides' If you also include four thirds), is because they both have clear down sides of one sort or another. There is still technical problems with both and until someone makes one or the other 'without inherent' down sides then the two way split will continue.

Cheers....grumpy Steve.

George Lazarette

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 19:06
niblue wrote:
.......I hope that we do see a move to full (35mm) sized sensors in consumer specification digital bodies. This is mainly because the area most adversely affected by the smaller sensor size is wide angle, and that's what I use most often.........

I am afraid that this is an example of hope triumphing over reason. All the signs are that APS-C will be Pentax's consumer sensor size for the future, and that if APS-C is abandonned, it will be for an even smaller sensor, not a larger one. Why? Because, unless it is only a little larger, they will have to manufacture yet another set of new lenses. I don't see this happening.

Those who want a larger sensor will be able to buy the 645D.

Including the fish-eye, Pentax now has four DA lenses with an AOV (at the wide end) equal to or wider than 24mm on a 35mm film camera, and two more with an AOV equal to or wider than 28MM. I consider that to represent a pretty good choice, and there are more wide lenses on the way.

There are also third party lenses.

There is nothing yet to match the old 15mm, but I wonder how many people actually owned one. Not too many, I suspect.

G
Keywords: Charming, polite, and generally agreeable.

Mannesty

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 19:13
bretbysteve wrote:
If you really do have the lenses which give you the results you need/want then who cares a fig If they are a good investment or not?

Steve,

Frankly, I care, and a tad more than a fig.

I've just bought one DA lens for roughly £300. If I were to continue to buy the remaining DA lenses that I need/want they represent a considerable financial investment. I'm a hobbyist photographer who doesn't (yet) sell my images. I'd take great comfort from knowing that in 5 or 10 years time that this investment is still going to be worth something at least.

Just take a look at the prices that some very good lenses are typically fetching on Ebay for instance. My son recently picked up a near perfect FA 80-320MM for £40. OK we take a risk buying anything unseen, but a £40 risk that goes sour is a lot easier to swallow than a £600 - £700 one, as is the price of the 12-24mm DA lens. Is that going to be worth only £40 - £50 in a few years time. I hope not.

Truth is, I probably do already have all the lenses I need/want at the moment with some surplus and I don't forsee me buying any more DA lenses in the near future. I've only decided to buy the 16-45mm DA lens based upon the praises echoed throughout this forum and the fact that I'm not overly happy with the results I'm getting from the 18-55mm kit lens.
Peter E Smith

My flickr Photostream

Ammonyte

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 21:48
Mannesty wrote:
Well I've bitten the bullet as it were. I've ordered the 16-45DA lens from Pixmania.com who have it in stock for £274.00 + £8.00 Delivery.

Pete,

Well I hope you get the lens. After I ordered my Optio Wpi (for carrying up
mountains) I had to deal with endless prevarication from Pixmania.



I googled them and found that an awfully large number of people complaining about the same thing. They seem to have a habit of quoting items as "in stock" when they are not. A lot of their stock are "grey imports", oh and if you need Pentax to repair the lens, don't mention Pixmania, or they'll roll their eyes a lot.
Tim the Ammonyte
--------------
K10D & sundry toys
http://www.ammonyte.com/photos.html

Mannesty

Link Posted 09/04/2006 - 23:29
Ammonyte,

Thanks for the info. I wasn't aware of the issues surrounding Pixmania but I have bought from them before with no problems. Time will tell.

I've paid by credit card and distance selling laws allow me to cancel the sale within 7 days so I think I'm pretty well covered.

Grey import or not, if needed, Pentax UK should honour any warranties offered . . . shouldn't they.
Peter E Smith

My flickr Photostream

Mannesty

Link Posted 10/04/2006 - 08:37
Ammonyte,

It seems you might be right about Pixmania. The lens is now showing availibility of 8-10 days and my order has not yet been 'validated' (whatever that means).

I've cancelled my order with them.

Correction to my original post re Distance selling:

Right of withdrawal

In conjunction with Article L 121-20 of the Consumer Code

The customer shall have a period of 15 working days (fifteen clear days required by law) in which to return, at his/her own expense, any products failing to meet with his/her satisfaction. This period shall run from the date on which the customer's order was delivered. In the event of this period ending on a Saturday, Sunday or a bank holiday, it shall be extended to the first working day thereafter.
Peter E Smith

My flickr Photostream

Mannesty

Link Posted 10/04/2006 - 12:39
It seems I may have ben a bit hasty in cancelling my order with Pixmania. When I ordered it on Saturday the item showed as in stock. Upon checking the progress of my order, the item showed availability 8-10 days and my order was not validated. I then cancelled the order on Pixmania and re-ordered from Park Cameras (it'll be here tomorrow). Now Pixmania shows the item in stock again. I think that they had one in stock to fulfil my order but their stock system works a lot faster than their order processing department.

Anyway, it's done now albeit £25.00 more expensive from Park.
Peter E Smith

My flickr Photostream

Daniel Bridge

Link Posted 10/04/2006 - 13:23
Peter,

Well done for supporting British business! I got mine from Parks last week - I had seen they were in stock at Pixmania, but had also heard the tales of woe, so steered clear of them.

Enjoy your new lens!

Incidentally, I'd seen that Cameraworld had the lens listed at £299, but when I asked in-store, they didn't have them in stock and currently "weren't ordering from Pentax", the Staff didn't know why.

Dan

McBrian

Link Posted 10/04/2006 - 16:53
Quote:
Including the fish-eye, Pentax now has four DA lenses with an AOV (at the wide end) equal to or wider than 24mm on a 35mm film camera

George, what about the DA12-24 and the DA14, that equivelant to 18-36 and 21 in 35mm format, pretty damn good as far as wide angle goes is it not. How many of us had wider that 18 or 21 with our ME's, P's, SF's......?
Cheers
Brian.
LBA is good for you, a Lens a day helps you work, rest and play.

Mannesty

Link Posted 10/04/2006 - 16:58
Thanks Dan. I am happy with my decision to switch to Park Cameras for this lens. Especially as I recently got an email from Pixmania which I will share with the members of this forum:-

Message begins:-

Dear Peter,

Thank you for your email,

As you can read from the product information sheet and from our terms and conditions the PENTAX manuals do not always come in English.

We apologise for this inconvenience but you can download the manual from the following site:

http://www.pentaxusa.com/docstore/index.cfm?show=6

Best regards, Cécilia

Team Pixmania

Pixmania.com : Number 1 in Europe. Low prices guaranteed. Always in stock.

Pixmania is a Fotovista company.

Message ends:-

They tell me this AFTER I place the order, and in response to my order cancellation. I had enough trouble translating the Spanish instructions for the new toaster we bought a while back . . . and the manual for the car is gathering dust in a drawer somewhere, I bought a new English Manual in UK. I ain't about to start learning French.

I particularly like the little tag "Always in stock" . . . yeh, right.

Ammonyte, Thanks for the heads-up, I owe you one.
Peter E Smith

My flickr Photostream
Add a Comment
You must be registered or logged-in to comment.